What part of NO doesn't our gov't understand?

[Metella]

This goes for Dem & repubs alike who are letting non-related things pass, things were never meant to be hidden. One more disgusting things about our government. Am I just getting old and grumpy - or do our representatives seem to be really getting worse?


www.nwf.org/enviroaction/index.cfm?articleId=500&issueId=52

Say - if you follow the email your rep link in this article - you can send your voice out very easily - takes less than 2 minutes! and it is automatic so you don't have to look up anything.

[Lilee]

AAARGH! My ISP gives me a stop sign when I click on the link. I'm gonna try to go to the site 'cuz I bet I'll have something to say. I'm old and grumpy, too, these days.

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

I've just e-mailed them, I'm usually not into political matters but I have been following this issue for years & I may be only 24 but I' am also 'old & grumpy' when it comes to this! Come on everyone e-mail your rep! Save the Artic wildlife refuge from needless drilling!

[trisha]

Whatever oil that's there is not going to help our energy problems anyway -- it's like putting a band-aid where a tourniquet is needed.

Like Metella noted, and is noted on the site, our nation needs to develop other energy sources. We are too dependent on cars, and most residential areas don't have adequate public transportation for any type of mass transit. Our urban sprawl will be our downfall if we can't get our politicians to stop catering to the oil and automotive industries and face reality.

Don't get me wrong, I care about the animals. I just care more about my kids and their future, and the future of America. I don't want to sink another penny into developing new oil fields or invading or restructuring oil rich nations. In the future scheme of things, oil is obsolete. To spend money clinging to the past instead of preparing for the future is just stupid.

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

Well aren't they in the process of developing a fuel source that comes from vegetation or something like that? Public transportation is great, but what about those of us who live out in boonies? There isn't a means of public transportation that can get way out to us & besides, my job requires that I have a car.

The main thing I'm worried about is will this new fuel produce the same about of horsepower that my current truck does (350 HP) because if it doesn't then no sale. I hate being a slave to the oil merchants as much as anyone, but I also have a three horse slant trailer to pull.

IMHO there is too much of people not seeing the animals of this planet as important as the oil that comes out of the depths of it (hey they WERE here first, you know).

I don't see what the big deal is about electric cars & this new veggie-fuel, the oil we have now will last through the course of my lifetime anyway & this may sound selfish but thats all I care about. In reality I know that our government won't look at plan 'B' until they've bled plan 'A' dry & exhausted all options related to it.

[maherjunkie]

Don't worry, it pulls Willie Nelson's tour bus.

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

Maherjunkie>> Okay LOL, but how expencive will these modified cars be? Because I hope they don't make them only affordable to the rich.

[trisha]

We have "flex fuel" on our '03 Yukon. It was an $800 option when we got the truck, but it will be standard on most GM vehicles soon. Hopefully then more gas stations will carry E85 and the price will go down. There is only one in my general area, and they keep the E85 at the same price as regular gas, which is such a rip off.

I get crap mileage with it, too -- like 10 mpg compared to the 17 I get with premium. This makes it very much not worth it for me to use.

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

I hope they don't all of the sudden go to 'flex fuel' or anything like that & all of the sudden dump regular ole' gas. What are people like me who have 'obsolete' vechiles & no means of paying to replace them supposed to do?

Until they find a suitable source for replacing oil, I'm sticking with what 'ain't broke'.

[trisha]

But it is broke, because it's starting to take more energy to pump the oil (since what's left is down deep) than the amount of energy the oil being pumped has the potential to produce!!!

Don't worry, when more people switch to ethanol or other renewable resource based fuels, the price for both ethanol and regular gas should go down because of the laws of supply and demand. People who are paying $2.70+ for E85 are paying for the start up costs of implementing a new system. Once more stations have E85 pumps, and more ethanol refineries are built, the price should go down. And once the the demand for regular gas goes down, the price should drop -- some. It will eventually have to climb again, though, because like I first wrote, it's beginning to cost more money and energy to pump it than what it's worth. That's what "peak" means. We know that almost all US oil wells have peaked, and it is suspected that the Russians and Saudis have peaked (it's not in their best financial interest to say, but the speed at which they're producing is pretty indicative of peaking.) It's an eventuality that all oil wells will peak. So, if you are intent on staying reliant on oil, you will have to pay for the imbalance of using more to get less.

Iraq and ANWAR are just band-aids. They cannot fix the imbalance; only temporarily reduce its effects.

[maherjunkie]

kawaiidragonfoe821 said:

Maherjunkie>> Okay LOL, but how expencive will these modified cars be? Because I hope they don't make them only affordable to the rich.

Bill Maher said his hybrid cost 20,000. Willie just pulls up to a fast food place.

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

Fast food is icky! LOL Well I guess that oil will eventually go the way of the VHS tape, you can still fint them at the video store, but they are a fraction of the price they once where when I was young. Same with Tube TV's VS plasma & LCD.

[Metella]

I saw a drag race between an older gas run and an electric run ....

the electric car (once warmed up) was less than a second behind the dragster in the 1/4 mile!!!! Now that is a wow and should set your mind at ease about the fun you can still have whipping around curves.

Yes, that statement was oddly selfish - if it won't break in your lifetime ... Ok - I see that point; but then you went on to talk about helping animals .... well if we dont' STOP emmissions the greenhouse effect will continue to rise and wipe out 90% of those lovely animals .... but that will be after your lifetime. So - I just want to show how these things can be related.

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

Oh I'm not worried about whipping around curves LOL (though I have to chuckle at the thought of an electric vette, mustang etc...). It's pulling power, I have a three horse slant steal horse trailer that i need to pull & I just don't think that an electric vehicle will do the job. Flex fuel may power Willie's tour bus, but he doesn't have to haul anything behind it, the stress on the engine is totally different when you have something that weighs 5000 lbs dragging behind you with two 1000 horses in it.

I want to save the animals, but population increase & cutting down of the rainforest's will kill them off long before the greenhouse effect does. I've always been a advocate for the animals, but it's hard to remain that way when its clearly a losing battle.

As for that drag race, half a second behind is half a second behind. In a drag race you have no time to 'wait' for your car to warm up, it's gotta give you everything it has right then. Plus if they go to all electric I'll miss the fire breathing nitro dragsters!

[Metella]

a drag being a drag? well not really if our focus of concern was performance of electric cars vs fuel cars ...... see if you take a joe average fuel car off the street and drag it - it would come in 10 to 15 second at least behind the fuel drag car ..... therefore, if the electric car I watched ended up coming in 1 freakin second behind the fuel drag car - then it addresses the issue we were talking about as far as speed performance.