kacesq
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 194
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Post by kacesq on May 10, 2011 12:34:32 GMT -5
I believe it's "Boots on the Ground" with Jeri Ryan as a guest star.
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Post by idget on May 10, 2011 18:25:54 GMT -5
Wow, so many deep thoughts and wonderful observations. When it comes to people who suffer from schizophrenia many of them refuse to believe that they are sick or what most people refer to as "crazy". Hence their refusal to take medicine. This was summed up perfectly by Goren in See Me, only crazy people take medicine so if I don't take medicine I am not crazy. So no matter how much he may not think he is crazy he probably keeps this in the back of his head. I agree with you Jeffan about the wonderful directing in this episode and Rispetto, I wasn't to thrilled with some of the directing in season 8 I thought it was too choppy and in some cases not well edited. I thought the scene of Goren striding into the crime scene was awesome, like a general retaking the battlefield. I also agree with you about the wonderful scene at the school, totally well shot. I also have to say that so far I like the Capt. he seems supportive but not willing to take Goren's crap. Also seems very direct and to the point.
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Post by Moonbeam on May 10, 2011 21:33:33 GMT -5
Patcat, the psych session scenes will lead to interesting discussions. We're going to need more bats!
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Leonore
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 145
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Post by Leonore on May 11, 2011 7:09:31 GMT -5
I believe it's "Boots on the Ground" with Jeri Ryan as a guest star. Yes, the title is "Boots on the Ground" but in the promos it looks like more stuff is falling from the sky!! ;D I've been pretty serious about this episode, but there were plenty of fun Awwww! moments too! I don't know if Goren still has a cat allergy, but his nose was everywhere else! and when he asked Rodgers about olive oil and balsam and said holy oil...myrrh and Eames smiled with a look that said, "Oh, how I've missed these arcane, little facts you throw out!" I just loved it. Goren hitting tennis balls much to the annoyance of the player who wanted her racquet back. Goren ushering Johnny through to Theresa's office, then stepping into the doorway with him crowding Johnny's space. I appreciate the fact that the writers are honoring the details that made Goren and Eames the characters that we've come to care about and feel that we know. OK! Now I'll get back to serious analysis!
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Post by DonnaJo on May 13, 2011 10:13:06 GMT -5
Excellent observations, Leonore! I had to go back and re watch the tennis scene.
I truly love how the new show runner and writers are incorporating Goren's mannerisms into the new episodes. Most fit like a glove, but for me, the Goren hand slamming (twice) during the last interrogation of the killer seemed a bit much. I thought it was one Goren-ism too many in an episode chock full of them. As if they were just adding it for the fans.
All in all, it was a very good episode. I was very impressed with Julia Ormond. She is still so beautiful. If Goren does fall for her, it wouldn't be a surprise. I thought the insertion of the psych session was well done, especially the lead out.
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Post by annabelleleigh on May 13, 2011 11:16:22 GMT -5
IMHO, the most memorable part of this episode was Julia Ormond. She managed to convey substance and intelligence in an all-too-brief scene.
And DJ, I doubt that Dr. Paula will be given enough screen time to develop a romance with Goren -- although I do hope that the therapy scenes will include an examination of why a smart, attractive 50-year-old man has never found a life partner. That's a mystery I'd like to see cleared.
AL
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Post by skittles4me on May 13, 2011 11:33:55 GMT -5
I do hope that the therapy scenes will include an examination of why a smart, attractive 50-year-old man has never found a life partner. That's a mystery I'd like to see cleared. AL IMO It's because he is so screwed up he never opened himself up enough to commit to someone. Instead he pours his heart and soul into his job. Remember in Silver Lining Alex said to Sheila about Wesley's lack of commitment, "He's like my partner. He just wants to be left alone so he can catch the bad guys".
I think the therapy scenes will clear that up, and/or address his insubordination to authority figures. Wow! That's a lot to cover in 6 more 5 minute sessions. That Dr. Paula is good! LOL ;D Did we ever figure out her last name?
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kacesq
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 194
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Post by kacesq on May 13, 2011 11:34:10 GMT -5
I do think this is one of the areas we'll get some clarity on. Dick Wolf said that these sessions were intended to answer some of the questions that have been hanging around since Season 1 and definitely one of my questions has always been why Goren seems to have lacked a significant relationship or two... ETA: Apparently skittles and I were replying at the same time. I think, skittles, that your explanation is the most logical one OR that he did at one time have a significant relationship but he either was too devoted to his job and/or he was too distracted/busy taking care of Frances that the girlfriend said sayonara. It can't be easy to maintain a relationship with someone who (a) wants to be left alone to solve his little puzzles and (b) spent most weekends visiting his mom and talking to her on the phone throughout the week. Now, I'm not blaming Goren for either of those things, I'm just saying it's a lot to take...
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Post by Patcat on May 13, 2011 12:31:09 GMT -5
I can imagine some women backed out when they learned about his mother. And Goren may have decided a normal life wasn't for him. And his examples of marriage and relationships may have given him great insights as a detective, but not the best examples for a human being. There was, at least, Irene the banker, who seemed bright and normal enough.
Patcat
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Leonore
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 145
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Post by Leonore on May 13, 2011 16:37:19 GMT -5
We must also remember that throughout the course of this show that those closest to Goren have been targeted: Frances, his mother, in Wee Small Hours Eames, targeted by Jo in Blind Spot Frank by Nicole and Declan in Frame That might make him a little hesitant about letting anyone get too close
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lola
Rookie
Posts: 43
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Post by lola on May 14, 2011 8:35:55 GMT -5
First I must admit I have broken a rule and commited a crime. I could not wait for one year for season 10 to come to my country so I downloaded from internet. I did it willfully and out of pure passion. I will take any consequence for it, you may band me from this site or put me into cyber jail. It was worth it. I just love what I saw last night. Love the writting and direction were the arch-story is going. Love simbols and hints mentioned here before in this episode. Oh, about the allergy. I belive it was the girlfrend ( Lola )who was allergic to cats. That is why Eames poked him if he was eating fur balls for her. I used to wonder what happened to that smugly guy during the years.I remember writers throwing in little details about girls - 4 if I'm correct - Irene, Lola, Turkish girl in Germany, Chief of D's secretary ( but I think she was only for one night ). Well his romatic life I think ended when he returend to NY, joined the police and started to take care of his mother. And like someone already said it's taken it's toll. I like that he is portraited as a real cop with fears, frustrations and how can this kind of job affect you. Not like some superhero who can do everything including having a family and happy life ( think Arnie in True lies - blak ). Oh I love scene with psychologist. The way he entered the room all humble and then tries to throw her off by taking the stand like '' I'm the smartest man in the room , here's a riddle for you I know you can't solve '' then letting her know he knows the drill ( what did he think she will be impressed ? ). Changing from one topic to the other moving around. The way his body and hands moved when he finally sat down I think he was nervous or scared as hell. Total oposite of what he was trying to present and what body language told me. Kudos to VDO for this scene. I love the way she got through to him by saying ''you are aware the world is a a dangerous place. You find the way to surviving but your way can make other people unconfortable''. For me this is the moment when they conect. I saw on his face the pain he went trough his childhood and that he (probably ) had to raise himself to be what he is today ( remember scene with a kid at the end of episode Legion - how book from Mark Aurelius(?) helped him or in his words '' remember that book you read about being a warrior-that was good''). I don't know if anybody else saw it like this but I did. Did I say love too many times? \r\n Love,love, love.. love is all around us..love is in the air....
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Post by Moonbeam on May 15, 2011 16:02:37 GMT -5
I think he has abandonment issues. Everyone he's loved or known who was supposed to love him, left on some level. Mom's illness, "Dad's" indifference, Frank's drug use and even his mentor Declan Gage. I think he's too frightened to have a significant relationship, frightened that person will leave him too. It's easier for him to remain alone than to face the difficuties of losing someone close to him.
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Post by skittles4me on May 15, 2011 16:14:30 GMT -5
Eames has never left.
She withdrew her letter requesting a new partner. She returned after her maternity leave. She helped him during "Untethered". She got over her anger/hurt from the events in "Purgatory". She stayed after learning about his biological father. She passed on becoming captain of the MCS out of "Loyalty" to him. She has always had his back. She is still there after 10 yrs and doesn't appear to be going anywhere.
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Post by Moonbeam on May 15, 2011 16:59:54 GMT -5
I wasn't considering his relationship with Eames and take Gage out of the equation. I was thinking of the formative years, when the people around you are suppose to love, comfort and guide you. His mother was diagnosed when he was seven. His parents divorce and "dad" leaves when he's eleven. Who knows when Frank started using, but I figure probably in his teen years. I think those experiences had a profound effect on his ability to commit..."If I love you, you'll leave me, so leave me alone."
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Leonore
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 145
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Post by Leonore on May 15, 2011 18:16:19 GMT -5
I think that much of what has been said is true in these posts. We have seen or can deduce the problems with authority, abandonment and trust issues as well as the isolation and the scrutiny that Goren has been subjected to over the past few seasons. My problem with the "session" is when Paula asks him about looking at himself.
He is too analytical NOT to look at himself! I think he looks too much and thinks too much.
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