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Post by Observer2 on Mar 31, 2005 3:07:12 GMT -5
Don’t worry, I’ve got your back! And with all the flack flying, I KEEP forgetting to post about some of the fun things... Like, did anyone else notice the nice shot of the picture of that cherry red car...?? Looks to me like the very one, in that big, empty storage garage. Have we seen that photo before? And the others there... one looked like it might be a toddler... could that be Eames’ nephew? Anyone with a nice big screen TV?
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Post by det1stgrade on Mar 31, 2005 9:49:20 GMT -5
Yes, I noticed the pix of the Ferrari ...I meant to include that tidbit in my post yesterday, but forgot. Thought it was a nice touch...the Detectives keeping souvenirs of their solved cases.
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Post by NicoleMarie on Mar 31, 2005 14:28:36 GMT -5
Ahhh, NicoleMarie. I think get it now. Took me long enough, I know. When you said Goren didn't figure it out, you meant he figured it out, but only by using standard police work. Yep, agree to disagree! ;D Thanks for trying to understand. As long as you kept asking, I'd keep posting till you understood what I was trying to say, just like I wanted to understand what you were trying to say. We may not agree but, it is fun, albeit, tiring, trying to figure out another view. hehehehe I love this board! ;D
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Post by NicoleMarie on Mar 31, 2005 14:29:59 GMT -5
Like, did anyone else notice the nice shot of the picture of that cherry red car...?? Looks to me like the very one, in that big, empty storage garage. Have we seen that photo before? And the others there... one looked like it might be a toddler... could that be Eames’ nephew? Anyone with a nice big screen TV? I do! Let me look again! I noticed the car, not the tot. hehehehe I wonder if the tot is Kathryn's real son? I saw that Ferrari and instantly thought of Cherry Red too!
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Post by Summerfield on Mar 31, 2005 18:05:00 GMT -5
Ok, I saw the red car, but I for one can't see a toddler. Another looks like a picture of someone sitting at a desk talking on a phone. I can't even make out the third picture.
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Post by Metella on Apr 1, 2005 8:11:49 GMT -5
Cassie: sorry to stick this here, but my reply button wasn't on the WANT thread & it goes for all CI episodes:
I agree with you a 1 1/2 to 2 hour CI on Sunday would be perfect - but I want Goren in all of them (greedy). Of course, that would lead to a D'Onofrio breakdown & that would be mondo bad. I certainly would enjoy a 2 hour CI every week - they could show more of the criminal preparing, Cops doing thier leg work, ME doing some research and more explaining - yeah, I would like that a lot. oh well.
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Post by janetcatbird on Apr 9, 2005 23:33:33 GMT -5
Just caught the USA rerun, since I missed all the give-and-take here are my two bit impressions.
--Did not hear Deakins say "Shibboleth", but I heard him enunciate the Ts. As a choir singer always getting fussed at for enunciation, I had to smile at that.
--I don't think CI has to necessarily be an either/or proposal when it comes to Detective Work vs. Psychology. Goren, it seemed, used both. He has to have some skills in detective work to even get to the suspects and build the logical case--psychology comes in for motive, and how to work with them. Besides, some stuff like this just don't make sense, to use the vernacular, so the psychology colors the bare-bones (but equally important) facts. How many times have people complained that we missed the all-important link from A to C? Detective work allows us to keep up witht he detectives, so we can really enjoy Goren's psych-techniques at the appropriate time without being hopelessly confused and lost. Besides, it strikes me as more realistic and believable that way. Goren ahd to have some basic detecting skills or he wouldn't have made it in the force, he could have just become the analyst.
--Not a big viewer of SVU, I've seen bits and pieces. What I've seen, I like, but I never make a point to watch. Although to be perfectly honest, I've never especially cared for Mona Lisa, or much Picasso either. (And let me tell you, be very careful how you analyze Michaelangelo's "David" in front of "Sex and the City" fans, that was an interesting Florence conversation...)
--I didn't find this episode especially graphic. I mean, we know the stuff happened, but even the dead body wasn't too awful. If cops don't learn to deal with it matter of factly, they won't succeed (is my guess, at least). I got a little queasy hearing the phone call, but while the pictures are "Ick" it's just-wel, here's what we're working with, next step. I get freaked out more with psychological abuse than anything else. I got more worked up over Kevin's comments in the interrogation roon than the pictures of bras and panties.
--Oh my gosh, terrific casting! I though the man playing "Jake" was wonderful--his facial expressions and that hasty "Nothing" in the last scene really showed the scared, confused little boy. And what a sick--oh, I can't think of an adequate phrase for the "father". That voice, especially. Y'all know that's what I notice, but he was creepy.
--Yay Carver! That smooth, cool, detached courtroom scene was terrific. "My mistake. You have your own unique style." All I got to say about that.
--Deakins is getting in there too, good for him. For once I noticed that baseball Observer has pointed out. The only other past case I remember him getting triggered on was the jogger in--was it "Monster"? SO I think that helps to reinforce Deakins-as-cop, and not just the guy who goes around to scold Goren and Eames. (Although Eames comment aobut the "step easy" speech also implies that not only has he been doing his job, maybe implying a bit of that political animal hyped in releases, but also that it's consistant. Erbe did a nice job of the whole "been there, done that" attitude after coming from the chat.)
--I too enjoyed Goren's handling of the father situation. He implies that there's something going on deep, but it doesn't prevent him from doing his work. He's even gotten better at montioring himself--not only did he catch himself, but he could own up to it and work on without getting all hung up. ("FPS", remember, he sent Bishop to apologize for him while he mucked aobut feeling blah about himself and the situation.)
--Eames was at work as well, good for her. But talk about washing off the slime, she got stuck with Kevin that whole time, ugh! Understandable of course, as Goren knew what was needed to get to Jake and Eames had probably had her share of experience with slimeballs--least she didn't have to see him in a Speedo! I have a small TV in the dorm room, I didn't get a good look at those pictures but they definitely seemed to be personal. Was there one of a man and woman sitting together, like at dinner or something? Somebody with a bigger screen and a pause button please fill us in. (And we go one step closer to fanatics, but what the hey.)
Sorry to be so behind the times, but I just wanted to sound off. Later all,
Catbird
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Post by Observer2 on Apr 10, 2005 2:03:29 GMT -5
Hi, Catbird, Better late than never. On the psychology vs detective work, I, too, think that the two work well together. There’s a third element, though, that I like, but some people find irritating. That’s Goren’s ability with non-linear reasoning – the global, gestalt, pattern recognition abilities that produce the sudden insights that so many people complain about as “leaps of logic” that they can’t follow. One of the classic images of that was in Maledictus, when he was just sitting in the little side room, looking at all the pictures, until the different pieces all came together – not in a linear way, step by step, but in a sudden realization, and he knew what happened. That ability to work well with *both* linear logic (classic detective work), *and* non-linear reasoning is one of the things I really like about Goren. And generally, when people say, oh, there was no way for him to make that “leap,” there really was – the information was all there, it just took someone with good non-linear reasoning to put it all together. I do understand that not everyone enjoys that kind of thing as much as I do – but it really is a valid form of reasoning, and I enjoy watching it in action. You mentioned other cases that have affected Deakins... have you seen all the first season? Yesterday was an episode with a case that really got to Deakins. And there’s a particularly nice moment between Goren and Deakins when it becomes clear that the guy Deakins had pegged as the doer was innocent. That’s still one of my favorite scenes in the entire series. With those pictures, yeah, I think there is one with two people (or three?) at what might be a restaurant table. The one that I think is beside that I couldn’t make out much of at all, but might be the one someone referred to as looking like someone on the phone (my TV is neither very large nor very clear). Below those two, just before you loose sight of the pictures altogether, is one that, again is very unclear. It looked to me like it might have been one person, standing up, and for some reason it looked to me like it might be a close-up picture of a little kid. The fact is that the image is so vague on my set that it could be almost anything. If I get the chance I’ll go back and look again – but on my set if you slow or stop the frames the image just gets blurrier, so I probably won’t have any more luck figuring it out than I had before. In any case, I don’t think the exact nature of the pictures is so important. It’s just kind of a nice detail – a place where they can put up pictures (since their desks are out in the middle of the room, with no wall to put pictures up on where they sit). And having the Ferrari prominently displayed was a very nice touch.
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Post by Patcat on Apr 10, 2005 7:43:33 GMT -5
I think that to be a great detective, fictional or real, one has to be able to handle both the physical and psychological investigation. And one of the many things I like about both Goren and Eames is that they both do both things well.
I agree, though, that one of the things Goren does particularly well is putting things together. And LOCI often does a very good job of demonstrating Goren's thought processes in a visual way.
Patcat
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