Alternate ending of Great Barrier

[SarahIvy]

eleana said:

You know, I don't get it, if Nicole Wallace is really driving that many people nuts, why did the majority voted for her to get away?

You know, I suspect there are a couple of reasons Nicole got voted to continue on.

For one, I bet you there are other people like me....I was SO incredibly annoyed with the gimmicky does she live or die, cast your vote nonsense. Therefore, my choice was to NOT vote. I kept going on to my poor husband about how such an obviously tacky move was beneath my show and offended my delicate artistic sensibilities Frankly, I wish I had voted....even though I disliked the concept of the vote as much as I dislike Nicole Wallace.

Then there's just the average viewer...I doubt the average viewer is as into the show as we here are. They're just watching for pure fun entertainment, and they're going to vote for what would cause the most drama. I bet a bunch of the votes were from people who just wanted to see Nicole come back again and again because she's exciting and causes soapy drama.

I've always been on the fence about her. I liked the whole concept at first of the arch nemesis, and I even liked Nicole ("liked" as in appreciated her utterly horrifying level of conniving EVIL). Certainly I don't like seeing Goren messed with, but the first couple of Nicole episodes provided some great character development and scenery chewing. It was fun to loathe her.

But then her story just got so completely over the top and outlandish that they lost me. Now I just want her gone and I hope that when the show comes to a close they don't use Nicole as the finale....I hope they get her goose long before then.

Also, I really should have gotten over myself and just freakin' VOTED

[Techguy]

I've said this before but I'll repeat it: if Nicole were a man there wouldn't be any nonsense about a romance with Goren. I never thought of her as a worthy adversary for him, and still don't think so. Time has long since passed for an endgame episode, with Goren checkmating and eliminating this annoying Nicole pest for good. Please Season 6, give me some relief.

And as for the vote, how do we know for sure if viewers did indeed choose to let her live? As I understand it, Rene Balcer originally intended for her to die because he realized there was no where else to go with the character. But the NBC NUTS wanted the story to continue for ratings purposes, so they convinced RB to leave it up in the air, whereupon the cockeyed vote idea was hatched to supposedly give CI fans the chance to determine Nicole's fate. Since the story was already altered to pacify the NBC suits, who's to say the results weren't rigged to provide an outcome they wanted in the first place, regardless of what the viewers decided? Personally, I'm skeptical and cynical not only about the entire sham of a voting process, but the outcome too.

[Eléana]

Ok, you know what, this is what I think: if NBC doesn't kill Nicole soon, the fans will kill the show. It's such a stupid move, trying to raise ratings by turning a perfect fantastic detective show into a soap. It's almost suicidal for the show. As for plotwise, Goren is supposely the modern portral of Sherlock Holmes, and Nicole Wallace is supposed to be Irene Adler. First of all, if Goren's archnemesis is a guy, like Professor Morarity to Holmes, then life would be a lot better, I'm sure all the girls are happy. Second of all, even if Nicole is supposed to be Adler, I've actually finished the entire The Complete Advanture of Sherlock Holmes, and I think Irene Adler is portrayed as a intelligent women who simply outsmarted Holmes. One of the purpose for her role in the novel is to show the feminist power during a male dominance time period. Irene Adler, as far as I know, is not a criminal, even though she did blackmail the king of Bohemia, but she stopped after she got married, and moved away, out of the lives of the people that she once jeopardized. I see that ending as reasonably satisfying, because she's not a bad woman, after all, unlike Nicole, who only killed, well, let's say a hundred, plus or minus another ten people. And get this, IRENE ADLER AND SHERLOCK HOLMES WERE NEVER ROMANTICALLY INVOLVED! Holmes respects her and call her "The Woman". As for the gross romance plot that NBC came up, I think it's soapy enough to watch my cloth. Ewww... Even though I'm atheist, I'm still praying that she gets kills some point in the next year, or I really would lose faith in the whole Good vs. Evil princinple in this show.

[Cassie]

techguy said:

I've said this before but I'll repeat it: if Nicole were a man there wouldn't be any nonsense about a romance with Goren. .

I agree wholeheartedly, but I got to ask you, As a man do you find Olivia D'Ablo aka Nicole Wallace to be a beautiful woman? or just your average gal?

I think Goren saw her as beautiful, until he discovered what lurked beneath her skin.

As for the infamous vote on whether she lived or died. From what I understand the TPTB where quite shocked at what impact Nicole had on the viewers. That the viewers were angry that she hurt Bobby in that first interrogation scene.

Goren has only shown twice maybe 3 times that he has an interest in woman. The 1st time he meet Nicole, 2nd time, in the restaurant where he ordered his veal parmigan for the 1st time. and in Sex Club, when he almost broke his neck watching those bunnies leave the Squad Room.

I guess all I am saying is I feel they brought Nicole back for the female viewers who enjoyed watching Bobby struggle with his feelings for Nicole. Both are physically attracted to each other, While Goren is repulsed at what she is capable of doing. If the character of Goren had a significant other in his life other then his mother. There would have been no need for the continuation of the Nicole character. The female viewers would be involved in that storyline

techguy said:

Personally, I'm skeptical and cynical not only about the entire sham of a voting process, but the outcome too.

I didn't buy it either. Great Barrier episode....Stunk to the High Heavens.....anyone in their right mind would have voted for her to die in that show!! She had lost her edge, even Goren had said so!!

[Eléana]

I'm sorry Cassie, but the idea of Bobby and Nicole is just too gross, it doesn't matter what the motive is, but coming up with such a hideous plot really requires a poorly-wired neurosystem. ;D Having the two together won't achieve anything but losing lots (I do mean lots) fans. And if there has to be a girl in Goren's life, why can't it be Eames? I'm not that big of a shipper, but if I had to choose, Eames really isn't bad, compare to THE UNSPEAKABLE THING. Ewww again.

[Cassie]

Oh I am not saying that Goren and Wallace were meant to be.
Just that is my theory on why they brought her back.

But I truly did love the Grow episode

I really do believe people can change. At least try to make the attempt to do the right thing! and that is why I loved Grow so much

What I really didn't like about the Great Barrier episode was the ending. IF, the last 15 minutes went off in 2 completely different directions other then the last 2 minutes, I would have been more satsified with casting my vote.

[Eléana]

I hate to be such an extremist, but yes people can change, but some people are just damaged beyond repair. I've never watched Grow, and if you read one of my earlier posts, you would know that I've taped all these Wallace episodes, but never watched it. I just have to wait til she dies to be able to watch those episodes without getting so angry and destroy the TV. So I can't make much comment about her, but judging by what I learned from Wikipedia, I'd think it's nice enough that Bobby "ruined the last chance for her to be happy and have a family". (I'm beginning to think that I'm rubbing off some of the sadism off Goren, lol). As for Great Barrier, I think we all believe that there's some injustice done to the episode by NBC, and let's just cross our fingers and hopes that she'll be gone before we all die of old age. ;D

[Eléana]

I think Holmes calling Irene Adler "The Woman" mostly out of respect for her intelligence. But we call Nicole Wallace "The Woman" in a more negative context. Wallace is not really "The Woman" but "The Thing" or "The Hideous Unspeakable" ;D

[Techguy]

Cassie, thank you for your perspective and your comments. As to your question, as a man I can honestly say Olivia D'Abo does little for me either physically or artistically. I can take or leave her, she's basically a non-entity. I know very very little about her acting roles besides NW on CI and very vaguely as the older sister in the TV show "The Wonder Years."

As for the NW role, I find her repulsive, not only in terms of her scripted behaviors, but also in terms of what I believe CI has had to do to prostitute themselves in order to justify keeping her around and explaining her appearances and repeated escapes.

I can relate to a lot of what's in your post. However, I disagree with your statement regarding Goren and Nicole: "Both are physically attracted to each other." I have not seen this attraction, and still don't, except for very briefly--MAYBE--in her first appearance in "Anti-Thesis." Maybe, just maybe, Goren might have been drawn to her when he still believed she was the college professor Elizabeth Hitchens. However, once it became clear who she really was and what she had done, whatever was or could have happened was nipped in the bud. Certainly after she brought up his traumatic past in "A Person of Interest" and used his issues with an absent deadbat father so callously, and seemed to take great pleasure in doing so, I don't think any man in his right mind would find such a manipulative--and dangerous--woman even remotely attractive.

I absolutely do not believe Goren has any physical/romantic or any other feelings toward Nicole, except perhaps contempt and loathing. She wasted her gifts of intelligence and wit in her misguided attempts to escape her traumatic past. Goren is too moral and has too much integrity to even contemplate hooking up with Nicole. If there are any feelings at all, I believe it is completely one-sided, her for him. But even there it's distorted and twisted, because Nicole at least has the smarts to realize Goren is the kind of man who could have loved "the sparkling little girl" if not for the terrible choices she had made. And because of this, I also believe she wants to destroy that which she cannot ever have. But...I have had quite enough of this warped little dance, I want it over and done with.

[SarahIvy]

techguy said:

I absolutely do not believe Goren has any physical/romantic or any other feelings toward Nicole, except perhaps contempt and loathing. She wasted her gifts of intelligence and wit in her misguided attempts to escape her traumatic past. Goren is too moral and has too much integrity to even contemplate hooking up with Nicole. If there are any feelings at all, I believe it is completely one-sided, her for him. But even there it's distorted and twisted, because Nicole at least has the smarts to realize Goren is the kind of man who could have loved "the sparkling little girl" if not for the terrible choices she had made. And because of this, I also believe she wants to destroy that which she cannot ever have. But...I have had quite enough of this warped little dance, I want it over and done with.

I am quoting this whole paragraph because it so perfectly sums up exactly how I feel about the whole Nicole situation. Thanks for saving me the typing, Techguy, I agree with every word! You did a great job of describing the nuance of the Nicole/Goren back and forth.

I too can hardly wait for it to be over and done with.

janethyland said:

Sarah Ivy,arent they planning another gimmick thing for next season?

Goodness me, I hope not! Bring her back one last time and have someone do away with her. No voting, no gimmicks. The end.

[Patcat]

I'm a big Holmes fan (how many times have I written that (g)), and agree that the Holmes/Irene Adler connection has been overblown. But I don't believe Balcer and company ever intended Nicole to be Irene Adler--I believe she was thought of as more of a Professor Moriarty.

And I also feel Techguy nailed Goren's feelings towards Nicole.

There's other evidence that Goren has had past relationships with women--in BADGE Eames teases him about a relationship he apparently had with a secretary in the NYPD, and he was apparently talking marriage with Irene a financial analyst.

Patcat

[caseyswife]

I believe the only thing I have heard about She Who Must Not Be Named returning is here: criminalmaster.proboards28.com/index.cgi?board=generalcidiscussion&action=display&thread=1143799185.

Techguy, you did hit the nail on the head with your wonderful insight. But, I think we are all forgetting one very important part of SWMNBN's pathology: she hates men! (See Hilary's interrogation in "Slither.") Even if she did have some sort of "romantic" fascination with our Bobby (or any other poor soul), she would always turn on him in the end. This is why I think her only interest in BG is to play with his mind and, ultimately, hurt him. And Bobby knows this to be true.

caseyswife

[Eléana]

I am on the verge of a nervous breakdown thinking about this THING. I agree with techguy, Nicole is essentially useless as a character, and her return is just a vain attempt that NBC made for a higher rating. And I'm almost so certain that there is no such a thing as Goren/Wallace romance. What I don't understand is why there's this impression that she is almost dominating, hurting and manipulating Goren. It's almost as if she's winning over him. Obviously Nicole Wallace is doing a bad job being the modern Irene Adler, and if she is really supposed to be Prof. Morarity, things would make a lot more sense, but then WHY CAN'T SHE BE A GUY AND SAVE ME ALL THOSE ADVIL?

[caseyswife]

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that SWMNBN is "dominating" Bobby, but her character has manipulated him, and caused him emotional pain. I would love to see the character gone, but it is out of our hands, and in the hands of TPTB.
Don't get too stressed, Eleana.

caseyswife

[Eléana]

TPTB? What is that? I'm having a hard time keeping up with your acronyms. I just want to see Bobby getting even with her for all the pain she put him through.