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Post by NikkiGreen on Apr 16, 2011 12:51:46 GMT -5
According to zap2it, JM "will guest-star in all eight episodes of the final season as a police psychologist. Her character, Dr. Paula Severin, is tasked with helping Goren (Vincent D'Onofrio) "unravel his tortured past and chart a course for mental stability."
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Post by DonnaJo on Apr 17, 2011 6:52:12 GMT -5
Thanks for the info, Nikki. Ms. Ormond is a wonderful actress. She was excellent in "Temple Grandin" and has been in more films than I can count.
I hope she brings some new viewers to the show.
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Post by outerbankschick on Apr 18, 2011 20:56:19 GMT -5
If we get a S11, they could utilize her as the psychologist who works with the detectives, the way Olivet and Skoda did...
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Post by Techguy on Apr 18, 2011 21:22:49 GMT -5
From BSC Review:It’s the final season and Goren never seems to catch a break in his personal life, so I’m wondering if the producers might throw the poor guy a bone and create a possible romance between doctor and patient. Sure, it’s totally unethical but it is Law & Order, after all, and Goren has never been one to follow the rules.Sorry, but there's breaking the rules and BREAKING THE RULES. How anyone can suggest Goren and his doctor engage in unethical behavior offends me. I don't want CI to go anywhere near this subject this season. If the writer wants a bone, go the butcher shop, just don't mess with Goren's moral compass.
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Post by skittles4me on Apr 18, 2011 22:57:20 GMT -5
Well you KNOW I agree with you Techguy! ;D But really, there has been so much emphasis on Goren's mental health and his recovery during season 10 that I can't imagine they would "go there" with his psychiatrist. In addition to being out of character for Goren, a majority of fans would find it distasteful and offensive as you stated in your post. Also,a romance with his Dr.would overshadow whatever breakthroughs he might have in therapy concerning his past. Instead of the viewers getting to see Goren emerging emotionally stronger and ready to "take on the world", they would be given a love story? Nah. I can't imagine the writers would change the focus like that. It would be a real departure from the Law and Order formula. They just don't give us overt love stories. This is what I keep telling myself because she is really pretty and as Kacesq pointed out, age appropriate, and why couldn't they have cast Betty White? :reaching for paper bag, breathing in, breathing out...:
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kacesq
Silver Shield Investigator
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Post by kacesq on Apr 19, 2011 5:17:26 GMT -5
Completely agree with both Skittles and Techguy...and keep breathing Skittles! If the whole point of the psychologist is to "set our star detective on a path to mental stability" I would argue that mental stability does not come from an unethical, inappropriate relationship with one's therapist. Quite frankly, we don't have enough time. We have EIGHT episodes where they have to solve crimes, reunite G/E and "cure" Goren. Any "romance" would get what? maybe 20 seconds an episode? Please.
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Post by jeffan on Apr 19, 2011 5:49:40 GMT -5
I agree there are only eight episodes so the focus on the therapy sessions will probably be limited. I'd like to see the writers end each episode with a scene between Goren and Severin which sees her putting the pieces of the fractured hero back together. I would definitely not like to see long-drawn-out weeping and wailing.
I’m actually looking forward to the one-to-one scenes between Goren and Severin to see how they compare to the electric scenes between Goren and Nicole Wallace.
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angua
Detective
Posts: 281
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Post by angua on Apr 19, 2011 9:41:40 GMT -5
I agree there are only eight episodes so the focus on the therapy sessions will probably be limited. I'd like to see the writers end each episode with a scene between Goren and Severin which sees her putting the pieces of the fractured hero back together. I would definitely not like to see long-drawn-out weeping and wailing. I’m actually looking forward to the one-to-one scenes between Goren and Severin to see how they compare to the electric scenes between Goren and Nicole Wallace. Ooooh, good observation, jeffan! We'll make a VDO fan of you yet! Edit: Techguy, much as I do not want Bobby to get into a relationship with his shrink, I honestly don't think that it would be BREAKING THE RULES on a level that would be against Goren's mental compass, from what I've seen. If we take Nelda into account, Goren has shown a tendancy to fall for people who care about him. I can't ever see Goren killing in cold blood, raping anyone, hurting a woman or a mentally ill person. But those are all things that Goren himself finds unethical and beneath contempt. I think he would be willing to challenge the "unethical" part of having a relationship with a consenting adult who happens to be your therapist. He's challenged the established ethical codes before, especially in the Carver episodes, convincing him to arrest practically everyone but the suspect to get the suspect in their grasp, so I'm going to have to--very reluctantly--disagree with you on this.
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Post by jeffan on Apr 19, 2011 10:25:07 GMT -5
You make excellent points Angua but I don’t think the writers will use a Goren/Severin romantic plotline. When you think of the show itself, it turned into a “will they-won’t they” subtext (Goren/Eames) by the shippers even though it was not the intention of the writers.
Episode eight will close open-ended so, if it does get picked up for another season, it would be straight back into the police procedural. If it did end with Goren and Eames walking into the sunset then I very much doubt there will be another season.
Who/what started this bunkum anyway?! It’s like something written on page six, then makes it to page two and, voila, it’s front-page factual news! Would there even be a discussion if Julia Ormond was not so attractive?!
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Post by skittles4me on Apr 19, 2011 17:06:55 GMT -5
Who/what started this bunkum anyway?! It’s like something written on page six, then makes it to page two and, voila, it’s front-page factual news! Would there even be a discussion if Julia Ormond was not so attractive?! This bunkum started here with the blog post Techguy shared, but I've seen the same discussion on other forums and blogs. It's a conclusion to which many have jumped. No, there definitely would not be a discussion if an unattractive person had been cast. However, a beautiful accomplished actress WAS cast as "Goren's brilliant psychiatrist" so that naturally leads to speculation. Quote Kacesq:If the whole point of the psychologist is to "set our star detective on a path to mental stability" I would argue that mental stability does not come from an unethical, inappropriate relationship with one's therapist.You would win that argument! ;D C'mon Patcat! Hit me with that bat! Knock me out cold and wake me when it's all over!
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kacesq
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 194
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Post by kacesq on Apr 19, 2011 19:38:05 GMT -5
I agree with skittles that the will they/won't they discussion about Goren and Severin pretty much started as soon as news Julia Ormond was cast hit. I've seen it here, Facebook, and other blogs, forums...it actually made me wonder what is it about fandoms or even casual viewers - as some on the Facebook page are - that as soon as there's a male/female relationship on a show, people immediately begin debating whether it's a romantic one... angua, while it may not be breaking the rules for Goren, wouldn't it be breaking the rules for Severin? I've always thought that relationships between therapists and patients were forbidden by the ethical code of the medical profession. Either that or one of the L&O mothership or L&O:UK episodes where a female psychiatrist had a relationship with a male patient. I would find it distasteful for Goren and Severin to have a relationship now while therapy is ongoing. To me, therapy implies vulnerability and trust and I just don't think embarking on a romantic relationship is appropriate at this juncture. Now, I think Severin needs to treat Goren to the extent he needs it, either for himself or for his job because this was a condition of his reinstatement, iirc. Flash forward a few years/months after therapy ends? I dunno. YMMV, of course. I agree with jeffan that the ending of episode 8 will be open and if there's a season 11, we're back to procedural. And I will be a happy camper, lol. And yes, Patcat, please bring out the ASP! I think I'm ready for my inaugural smack!
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Post by Patcat on Apr 20, 2011 11:37:44 GMT -5
I don't think anyone here has done anything to justify the ASP bat. But those other people (shakes head in wonderment). I stopped visiting some sites because of the wild speculation. And several of you posting here are right. It's amazing how quickly these speculations become fact.
I would be very disappointed if Goren had any relationship beyond the patient/doctor one with his psychiatrist. I think Goren is too ethical and too aware of the problems and issues to get involved in such a relationship. And I'd hope that he'd find a psychiatrist moral and ethical enough not to pursue such a relationship.
I've never understood the need to pair every male/female couple in a story. I never got the idea Bobby felt anything romantic for Nicole Wallace, and I always thought she was incapable of love for anyone. I admit to writing fanfiction that puts Bobby and Alex together, but one thing I really like about the two of them and the way their relationship is portrayed is that they are friends and colleagues who are not necessarily romantically involved.
Patcat
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angua
Detective
Posts: 281
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Post by angua on Apr 20, 2011 12:00:39 GMT -5
Notice, Patcat, that no one EVER ships the male pairings of the Original Series . . . do they?
On another note, kacesq, I thought about what you mentioned about a romance with Bobby being unethical for Severin, and it made me consider the implications for Bobby himself. While he would do anything to get a suspect, I doubt that outside of work he would think it okay to put SOMEONE ELSE in an unethical position, even if he himself finds it ethically acceptable. Does that make any sense? The result is that I really hope they don't go there with the shrink angle, because Bobby would find it unethical to screw around with the ethics o someone who is trying to help him.
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Post by Patcat on Apr 20, 2011 15:33:43 GMT -5
And we've seen many examples of Bobby's admiration for truly ethical people who act as they speak. And in her testimony in IN THE WEE SMALL HOURS, Eames states she's come to admire him as an ethical officer.
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Post by skittles4me on Apr 20, 2011 20:01:03 GMT -5
I don't think anyone here has done anything to justify the ASP bat. But those other people (shakes head in wonderment). I stopped visiting some sites because of the wild speculation. And several of you posting here are right. It's amazing how quickly these speculations become fact. I would be very disappointed if Goren had any relationship beyond the patient/doctor one with his psychiatrist. I think Goren is too ethical and too aware of the problems and issues to get involved in such a relationship. And I'd hope that he'd find a psychiatrist moral and ethical enough not to pursue such a relationship. I've never understood the need to pair every male/female couple in a story. I never got the idea Bobby felt anything romantic for Nicole Wallace, and I always thought she was incapable of love for anyone. I admit to writing fanfiction that puts Bobby and Alex together, but one thing I really like about the two of them and the way their relationship is portrayed is that they are friends and colleagues who are not necessarily romantically involved. Patcat The last couple I paired was Steve Austin and Jamie Summers! I really don't do it often, but something about Goren and Eames hit my shippy bone. I've never shipped any other Law and Order characters. However, I wouldn't actually want to see Bobby and Alex get together in the show! (unless it's the last episode!) I just don't want anything to happen that would make it unable for me to use my imagination while watching them or to enjoy fanfiction. Another reason that the whole beautiful brilliant shrink thing bothers me is that if Goren ends up with someone, then what about Eames? It would really bother me if they wrapped up the series and just left a loose end with her. And yes, I know it's a crime procedural. It isn't supposed to be about the character's personal lives, but the fact that the fans wanted Goren and Eames back and didn't warm up to Nichols and Stevens proves that their personal lives are important to us! I don't think the viewers will warm up to Dr. Paula Severin in just 8 episodes and MOST comments I've read are about how inappropriate it would be to pair her with Goren. :sigh: I hope they just give us a little bit of personal info as in seasons past and let us fill in the blanks!
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