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Post by DonnaJo on Jun 13, 2011 11:45:28 GMT -5
I can certainly understand why Dr. Gyson would assume that Goren was thinking of her in terms of a possible relationship. I'm sure that most if not all of the cops (especially single ones) that she has as clients try and hit on her. Couple that with his vagueness about having a relationship with someone that he respects, and you could see her saying "here we go again." For me the confrontation and him storming out was too melodramatic, and very typical of Warren Leight and how he likes to portray Goren. Even after Gyson apologized and was obviously sorry and eager to make things better, Bobby still left. Brings to mind the Season 6 Leight episode "The War at Home," when he trashed his desk and storms out of the sqaudroom.  I also felt badly for the daughter, trying to clean up mommy dearest' mess. I thought Goren would sympathize more with the daughter. I guess at her age blaming your Mom doesn't cut it when it comes to covering up a murder. For some reason I don't think we'll be given realistic closure about Goren and Eames and their situations. The way things are going in these shrink sessions, I fear that things will be either left hanging, or worst, the closure will be something ridiculous and unrealistic (Goren asks Eames or the doctor out on a date). |
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kacesq
Silver Shield Investigator
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Post by kacesq on Jun 13, 2011 12:04:02 GMT -5
I'm pinning my hopes - at this point - on Rene having rewritten the final episode. Because otherwise I could completely see your scenario coming true and I really wouldn't like it.
I think Rene also wrote the final episode of original L&O and while it wasnt' written as a series finale, it had a nice sense of closure, but you got the sense that the characters went on about their business, which I very much liked and would love to see replicated on CI.
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Post by DonnaJo on Jun 13, 2011 12:10:44 GMT -5
I forgot for a second about Rene Balcer doing the re-write!! Of course he'll make things right.  Thank you kacesq. I feel so much better.  |
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Post by jethro on Jun 13, 2011 14:31:14 GMT -5
I've corrected the subject line format (again!)
I presume that this time I've put it the correct episode name! ;D
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Post by skittles4me on Jun 13, 2011 16:21:32 GMT -5
I'm pinning my hopes - at this point - on Rene having rewritten the final episode. Because otherwise I could completely see your scenario coming true and I really wouldn't like it. I think Rene also wrote the final episode of original L&O and while it wasnt' written as a series finale, it had a nice sense of closure, but you got the sense that the characters went on about their business, which I very much liked and would love to see replicated on CI. Saw this elsewhere: Warren Leight tweeted this June 11th Re: the final episode: "I wrote all the shrink scenes and the final episode's last beat/ scene. Rene did a re-write of the final episode. Closure of sorts for us both" Here's Leight's twitter feed, scroll down close to the bottom, comment @joshmortonci: twitter.com/#warrenleighttv Some (not all original) thoughts about this ep: Loved them sitting in the car together with Bobby scrunched in the driver's seat. Did you notice how the mom had Bobby backing up in the lab? Don't see THAT very often! Guess it was like his own mom being overbearing and intimidating. Loved Bobby and Alex standing in the rain! And that little dog- too cute! Eames was good with the little girl. We usually see Bobby in that role. Victim would have loved his son. Another episode this season of lost love that "could have been". A marriage based on true love- they see that a lot! LOL When the captain speaks I hear "mwha mwhamwha mwha" - like the adults in the "Peanuts" cartoons. I think that this is Goren and Eames' last hurrah so the captain character has very little to do so as not to upstage them, but he really comes off as being useless IMO. The only date stamp I noticed was May 31. Goren told Paula "My drawbridge is up". Shouldn't it be down to let something in? The shrink scene- yes it was transference or something because I really can't imagine it going there. Paula was just answering the way shrinks do. They really can't give a definite "yes" or "no" to a question like that. She did say "yes" if he worked with her some more! I expected a flashback to Ma Goren. Maybe with next week's anger theme. |
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kacesq
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 194
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Post by kacesq on Jun 13, 2011 17:29:22 GMT -5
IMO, there really hasn't been enough discussion of Mother Goren in Goren's sessions and she's the key. I'm rather surprised by it, given Leight developed the whole Ma Goren theme during S6.
I'm wondering now about the final "scene/beat" Leight refers to. It had better be a closing scene with both Goren and Eames. I'll be a bit annoyed if it's Goren leaving the shrink's office (I say this because Rene said he does a walk-on in the last scene coming out of a building behind Vincent...)
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Post by outerbankschick on Jun 13, 2011 18:13:56 GMT -5
When Bobby allowed Dragon Lady to back him up, that was the key. He allowed it. He did it on purpose to let her think she was in control - and then he swooped and flayed her. And Leonore - YES to everything you just said! |
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Post by outerbankschick on Jun 13, 2011 18:15:30 GMT -5
I happen to be a Leight fan after S6-7 so I'm enjoying these scenes with the doc. Meaty! ;D
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Post by outerbankschick on Jun 13, 2011 18:17:28 GMT -5
DJ, I wish LOLA had been as "right" as LOCI. It had potential, I suppose. But you just can't take Law & Order out of New York and I am watching the repeats on Monday nights, and they are okay. But the reason I'm watching them is because they happen to air right after LOCI airs on NBC. I never made time for them before, and now that I've really had a chance to see some epis...I still wouldn't make an "appt" for viewing. They just don't have "it", IMO.
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Post by skittles4me on Jun 13, 2011 19:20:48 GMT -5
IMO, there really hasn't been enough discussion of Mother Goren in Goren's sessions and she's the key. I'm rather surprised by it, given Leight developed the whole Ma Goren theme during S6. I'm wondering now about the final "scene/beat" Leight refers to. It had better be a closing scene with both Goren and Eames. I'll be a bit annoyed if it's Goren leaving the shrink's office (I say this because Rene said he does a walk-on in the last scene coming out of a building behind Vincent...) I was very excited about seeing so much focus on Eames at the beginning of the season, but now it seems she is just a sidekick again. I was really hoping to get some idea about where she would be going from the last episode, but it seems there is hardly time to cover Goren now.  However, Warren Leight has always been good about including Eames so I'm optimistic he won't leave our girl hanging! Kacesq, HERE are some pics of G/E during filming of the last episode, and since those are the clothes they were wearing when they said good-bye to the crew, I'm assuming that it must be at least close to the last beat/scene.  I wanted to listen to my " Transference Bee-Bop" CD, but I couldn't find it.... |
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Post by Moonbeam on Jun 13, 2011 19:32:42 GMT -5
I liked the episode for the same reasons many of you have stated. I too liked how Mother Dragon pushed Goren back, back, back. I liked that subtle restraint when he told Harris to sit down in the interrogation room. Perhaps he should have applied that during his psych session. That session, I don't know what to make of it, but kacesq and obc have given me things to think about.
I've always thought therapy was a path to self discovery. A means of discovering what motivates ones self-destructive behavior. It appears Goren wants simple direct answers to his questions from Gyson. That approach works in his line of work, I'm not sure he realizes that it doesn't in hers. Someone mentioned his drawbridge being up while it should be down. In last night's episode, not only was it up, it was surrounded by a 20 foot moat.
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kacesq
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 194
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Post by kacesq on Jun 13, 2011 19:48:36 GMT -5
skittles, I cannot imagine the closing shot being anything other than Goren and Eames. I will be annoyed if it is anything but... Perhaps some final snark from Alex and a smile from Bobby as they leave 1PP for the day. |
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Post by Patcat on Jun 13, 2011 20:42:13 GMT -5
When I watched the "duet" (trio? quartet?) at the end, I realized Goren was doing two things--letting the mother think she was in control, and dividing and separating the daughter from the mother.
Patcat
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Post by DonnaJo on Jun 14, 2011 6:25:46 GMT -5
DJ, I wish LOLA had been as "right" as LOCI. It had potential, I suppose. But you just can't take Law & Order out of New York and I am watching the repeats on Monday nights, and they are okay. But the reason I'm watching them is because they happen to air right after LOCI airs on NBC. I never made time for them before, and now that I've really had a chance to see some epis...I still wouldn't make an "appt" for viewing. They just don't have "it", IMO. Oh, I agree with you about the problems facing LOLA being set in sunny California. A true Law & Order series needs the grit & grime of NYC, not to mention the wealth of talented Broadway actors. I think Mr. Balcer did an outstanding job in spite of it. When it comes to portraying Robert Goren, as you know I much prefer his approach to this particular character that he (along with VDO) created. That's what I was referring to in my comments. For me, only he can make the series finale right. So I eagerly await seeing "The Boy In The Blue Knit Cap"and Rene's light touch upon it. Kacesq, I agree that Mom Goren needs to be addressed in the sessions. Since she is Leight's creation (and a wonderful creation at that) I feel confident that he has written her in the sessions coming up. I am both eager about it and dreading it.  |
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Post by Patcat on Jun 14, 2011 15:42:51 GMT -5
I think Bobby is extremely upset whenever anyone thinks he's hitting on any woman. I think this is a result of the man he knew as his father and Papa Goren's skirtchasing ways. Bobby doesn't want to be thought of as being like Papa Goren in many ways, and especially that one. And then for Guyson to first suggest he feels that way about Eames and then that he feels that way about his psychiatrist--especially after he's just stressed that he respects her--clearly pushes his buttons in this area.
But perhaps these demonstrations of anger are good things? Maybe Bobby feels safe enough with Guyon (how the heck is her name spelled, anyway?) to show his feelings?
Patcat
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However, Warren Leight has always been good about including Eames so I'm optimistic he won't leave our girl hanging! 
