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Post by Metella on Apr 14, 2007 6:23:29 GMT -5
Yes - I go along with this - that was my first impression of the scene - that he was giving tacit approval for her to pursue this and not have him as a hurtle. I think for the most part, work relationships should not be pursued & his giving a quiet reinforcement was giving her an OK to do whatever she wanted without having to worry about Ross.
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Post by hannah on Apr 14, 2007 14:24:07 GMT -5
Ross does seem especially concerned about her. I'm not saying in a romantic way at all, but I still think it has to do with the fact that she confided in him about her husbands death. Also, the hurried "you didn't," I think she was sort of redeeming herself? Maybe she didn't want to look vulnerable.
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Post by DonnaJo on Apr 14, 2007 15:19:43 GMT -5
I agree that the last thing Eames' wants is her boss thinking that she's cozying up to a colleague. Therefore, the hurried yet firm, "You Didn't."
Even though she may appreciate his concern, Eames' doesn't want Ross knowing about or helping her with her personal life. I believe the only one she would open up to in that area is her partner, and even then not totally or completely.
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Post by Sirenna on Apr 17, 2007 16:51:20 GMT -5
Sirenna? Anyhow, you have been away a while, and it 's so nice to have you back. Where have you been, anyway? No thank you, lizzie I have a closet full of luxurious black cashmere sweaters... Oops, no, was just nodding off and having a little daydream. [w] ...I don't get the problem with Goren taking it to be dry cleaned and wearing it again. Personally I wouldn't be caught DEAD re-wearing it.
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Post by BegToDiffer on Apr 23, 2007 14:46:18 GMT -5
I hope its not too late to get in on this episode discussion. I don't get on the board as much as I used to. The end result of that is having to read 10 pages before commenting. Anyway......
I sign, but I am not deaf. Once I was in a restaurant with someone and there were two deaf folks signing. The person I was with asked me what they were saying. I nearly fell out of the booth. I told him I don't eavesdrop. I'm not comfortable with sitting next to a table of people who are talking loudly either. Its just not my business.
Re: Goren signing--I don't think he did all that well, but since he has always been awkward, I attributed it to that. His signing was that of an amateur. He didn't magically learn to sign and I don't think he learned it in the Army or he would be much better at it. Another reason it might have looked odd is that he signed as many deaf do. They don't sign in full sentences. Instead of saying, What is your name? They might sign "Your name". Since signs are based on concepts, how do you explain to a deaf person what "is" is? You can sign chair and the sign kind of looks like a chair. What does an "is" look like? So, they just don't use it. My thought is that the writers want us to believe that Goren really is a walking encyclopedia, and as great as I think Goren is, he doesn't know everything.
Re: The conversation between lawyer and client, Goren and the ADA were completely out of line. I am so glad Peter stood his ground. He did the right thing. Even in the skating rink, Goren was wrong to eavesdrop.
Re: The facial expressions when signing, they are important. Its hard to sign "happy" and get the point across if you aren't smiling.
Re: The episode had some mis-steps, including the reason for the killing, after all there are plenty of other doctors out there to do the procedure, but there are not many stories on TV, movies or anywhere about the issues in the deaf community. So, if it opened any eyes, that's not bad.
Okay, I think I've added more than 2 cents.
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Post by Summerfield on Apr 23, 2007 18:35:41 GMT -5
And when you're in a public place, it may not be your business, but you're still privy to the conversation. Why do the deaf think they should be afforded more rights than the hearing world, as it pertains to the right of privacy? They were in a public place. Would it be any different if we heard two hearing individuals arguing over something? I don't think so.
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Post by hannah on Apr 23, 2007 21:23:40 GMT -5
Yes it is different.
IMO if they are moving their hands in a way that showed they would be yelling, then its OK, but if they are just moving their hands normally, then that would just be talking.
If you can read sign language, like peter, then you could pick up any conversation from that sort of distance, unlike if they were hearing people. So, therefore it is different and unfair to them.
Not to mention completely unethical for Peter. He shouldn't be forced to feed Goren information just because Goren doesn't find it unethical.
Reasons like these is probably way deaf people (like the ones in Silencer) completely separate themselves from the hearing world.
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misty98
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 61
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Post by misty98 on Apr 23, 2007 21:33:04 GMT -5
In reply to Summerfield...just a thought...no snarkiness intended...
Those who speak with their voices can choose to whisper, if they want to keep their conversation made in public private, but those who speak with their hands don't have that option.
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Post by Summerfield on Apr 24, 2007 7:24:36 GMT -5
But their body language "told" Goren they were arguing. And for the purpose of investigating the crime, he wanted to know what they were saying.
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peachybc
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 109
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Post by peachybc on Apr 24, 2007 8:46:21 GMT -5
Goren and Peter were conflicted because Peter said it was a private party, therefore he shouldn't be asked to interpret. Goren's point was it may have been a private party, but it was being held in a public place.
What is the legal stance on this right to privacy issue? Any legal eagles out there who can the answer question of when a person can and cannot expect a right to privacy, whether the person is hearing or not?
PeachyBC
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Post by Cassie on Apr 24, 2007 10:43:19 GMT -5
Peachybc,
Hi, I would think since they were in public, it would be legally OK, since they were arguing. My feeling is this, if a person is arguing, their conversation is LOUDER then normal, and most heads would turn and listen, if they are out in public. it's only human nature, Not thats it right. And those two on the skating ring where arguing... I bet people on the skating ring where watching them, trying to figure out what they were saying. I feel that the courts would argue that point. Also if, Goren and Eames where there and saw them arguing. but it wasn't in sign. Would they sneak up to them, just to ease drop cause it was in a public place?
Beg To Differ, thanks for sharing about how the deaf leave out those little words like "is"
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misty98
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 61
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Post by misty98 on Apr 24, 2007 20:18:39 GMT -5
Hi, PeachyBC!
I'm a paralegal, not an attorney, but generally speaking, there is no expectation of privacy when a communication takes place in public. Even a communication with one's own attorney or clergyman is not privileged, if a third party is present when the communication is made.
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Post by hannah on Apr 24, 2007 21:56:16 GMT -5
This wasn't a legal issue. It was an ethical one.
I bet it is legal, but that doesn't mean Peter has to tell Goren anything. Goren doesn't understand Peters perspective because Peters had more experience with the deaf then him. He's been through so much with his parents being deaf. He has more understanding and is more sensitive with the subject.
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Post by Patcat on Apr 24, 2007 22:59:42 GMT -5
Peter is, to some extent, between a rock and a hard place. But he is a police officer, and his responsibilities and duties should have some bearing on what he does.
Patcat
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peachybc
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 109
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Post by peachybc on Apr 25, 2007 8:10:21 GMT -5
Hi, PeachyBC! I'm a paralegal, not an attorney, but generally speaking, there is no expectation of privacy when a communication takes place in public. Even a communication with one's own attorney or clergyman is not privileged, if a third party is present when the communication is made. Excellent. Thank you misty98 for your input. I understood Peter's personal reluctance. As he said, he was used to being an interpretor for the deaf, not an investigator. This case forced him to walk a fine line and be both. PeachyBC
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