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Post by LOCIfan on May 30, 2004 0:13:54 GMT -5
I've been going through LOCI withdrawal this week, and even though I know I should try to ration my first season DVD, I haven't been able to...
Anyway, I've noticed that the only writers from the first season who are still writing for LOCI in the third season are Marlane Gomard Meyer and Stephanie Sengupta, not counting our beloved Rene Balcer.
I always try to pay close attention to the credits (which is hard to do on LOCI, because they drag on so long) to note who wrote what. It seems as though the major writing force behind this show is Rene Balcer, but there must be something about each individual writer that comes through.
In the first season, Marlane Gomard Meyer wrote "Smothered", "The Extra Man", "Phantom" and "Badge". In the second season, I think she wrote the episode "Bright Boy", and in this season, I think she wrote "The Gift" and "Happy Family". When I thought about it, I realized that there's allways something very intimate about those stories. Something that reveals the dysfunction in very intimate family relationships. And I think that tone is unique to this writer.
Stephanie Sengupta also wrote four episodes in the first season: "The Faithful" (one of my all-time faves), "Poison", "Semi-Professional", and "Maledictus". In the second season, I know she wrote "Tomorrow" and this season I think she wrote "Fico di Capo" and "Undaunted Mettle". There is also a common tone to those episodes. There's something sort of epic or sweeping to them. Something almost bigger than life and very dark, but also with a sense of humor.
Anyway, I'm wondering if anyone else out there pays attention to the writers of each episode.
Do you have a favorite? Why? Do you see a common tone or thread in that person's writing?
Let's discuss.
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Post by trisha on May 30, 2004 13:24:51 GMT -5
Yes, lets  We were headed down this road a few months ago on the crew board. I believe the general idea was to put together individual threads for each writer, and discuss the common arch's and themes in their stories there, and then some threads about cross thematic arch's and common threads tying certain episodes and writers together. I think these are all fascinating ideas to explore. This can only happen once those of us with copies of the episodes and a way to view them start threads by naming the episodes each writer has done so we have a place to start. I have the dvd set (thank you my good friend) and a working dvd player, but my vcr is crap. So, all my second and third season tapes are collecting dust, (just like the crew threads  ) You have started us off on some good points, LOCIfan, and I think you are dead on about Stephanie Sengupta. She has written many of my favorites as well. It's difficult to chose a favorite writer because they all bring so much to the table. The one person I don't think this show could do without is Rene Balcer. It never ceases to amaze me how many stories he is given co-credit on, and stellar episodes he is credited for alone. My favorite's this season are Sound Bodies, which Mr. Balcer is credited for alone, and Shrink Wrapped, which Diane Son is credited for the teleplay, and co-credited for the story with Mr. Balcer. With all different episodes Mr. Balcer is credited on, it's hard to say if there is an underlying theme that he enjoys working with most. I admit to noticing as recently as DAW that writing about megalomaniacs is one psychological element that repeats in many of the stories he is credited with. Besides DAW, we can go right to the begining of the show to One, in which our villain is what I would certainly call a megalomaniac. Mr. Balcer is also co-credited with Theresa Rebek on Yesterday, and Pas De Deux with Warren Leight. Of coarse, I can't forget Connie in Sound Bodies. These are just off the top of my head, and with a list of each episode and who wrote it, I'm sure we could find all sorts of threads to grasp |
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Post by Patcat on May 30, 2004 14:04:20 GMT -5
I recall seeing an ad Mr. D'Onofrio placed in the trade papers (VARIETY, HOLLYWOOD REPORTER) that thanked Mr. Balcer for his work, so he shares your opinion.
Patcat
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Post by LOCIfan on May 30, 2004 20:11:17 GMT -5
Yes, trisha, I agree that the writer the show couldn't do without is Rene Balcer. It is hard to figure out what his common threads and themes might be, given the huge number of episodes he co-writes.
I also have the first season DVD (mine also a gift!!), but a VCR made in the stone ages. It's much better at destroying tapes than playing them. I didn't realise there had already been a discussion about the writers in the Crew Board (never having visited it). I suppose the credits for all shows could be found online at some site such as tvtome. Sounds like a project for a rainy sunday afternoon, but I wouldn't mind giving it a go. It'd be fresh ground to explore during the long, LOCI-less summer months.
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Post by trisha on May 30, 2004 23:04:27 GMT -5
I've looked around and haven't been able to find a per episode credit list anywhere. So, it looks like we will have to put one together ourselves if we want one :/
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Post by Observer2 on May 31, 2004 1:25:09 GMT -5
I remember such a list somewhere. I’ll check my “favorites” list on my browser and see if I can find it.
I think it’s true that the different writers each give the episodes they co-write a particular flavor. But the base is always the same. I think I remember one episode that didn’t have Balcer’s name on it at all. But even then, he would have had quite a bit of input.
As the showrunner, Balcer is the one who decides what stories get developed. And even in a script that didn’t have his name on it he would be giving feedback and suggesting changes throughout the writing process. As senior co-writer on the vast majority of stories, he directly shapes how the stories are structured and what elements get included or emphasized. You can tell a lot about what themes he’s particularly interested in exploring, because they’re the underlying themes of the series itself, the ones that echo through episode after episode.
Trisha, I have a different take on the characters in One and DAW. I don’t see signs of true megalomania in either of them. In Sound Bodies, if Connie really did see himself as a prophet, and really was thinking in terms of amassing a larger following, that would be suggestive of megalomania.
In the other cases, though, it seems to me that you’re using the term in a popular, rather than psychological sense. I know that’s how people usually use that kind of term, but it may make it more difficult to talk clearly about the themes being explored by a writer who has an extensive knowledge of, and interest in, forensic psychology.
For instance, the element I see as most resonant among those three perpetrators is not grandiosity, but a pathological need for control. It’s triggered in different ways, serves a different psychological function, and is expressed in different ways, but it’s there, front-and-center, in each case.
Interestingly, these three perpetrators are all ones that Goren analyses from the outside – as opposed to his empathetic insight into Julie in Suite Sorrow, for instance. Goren may have issues related to control – and some of his behavior patterns indicate that he does – but he does not express them by trying to control other people for his own purposes. Of course, as soon as I wrote that, I had an image of him ruthlessly manipulating a suspect. So there’s an interesting theme – something he finds abhorrent in people who do it for their own purposes, he routinely does in the service of protecting possible future innocent victims.
Goren's ability to synthesize psychological understanding and intuitive insight really is a gift; and I was struck again, watching tonight’s repeat of Mad Hops, by how angry he was at the coach for abusing so similar a gift....
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Post by trisha on May 31, 2004 11:24:15 GMT -5
Observer, I see what you mean about the difference in grandiosity and pathological need, but we will have to agree to disagree on whether or not that constitutes a totally different animal than megalomania. I believe the pathological need for control is the ear mark of a megalomaniac, and that the triggers and personal affect are what differ from individual to individual. I agree with you about the way Goren reacts to this type of person, and it's funny that you brought it up because I was just thinking about the reactions others have had to this type of episode and the emotional involvement that is demanded of the audience to understand the motive, and thus the entire episode. I'm sure you have also read all of the complaints about episodes like DAW and Pas De Deux. It's probably better not to get into analyzing the other fans, so I'll stop here I hope you can find that list in your favorites, or recall where you may have seen it. |
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Post by NikkiGreen on May 31, 2004 19:49:19 GMT -5
A list for Season 1 based on insert with DVD set: EPISODE TITLE………………… TELEPLAY/STORY………………....DIRECTOR ONE………………….……..………. Rene Balcer/Dick Wolf…….…………. Jean de Segonzac ART………………………………........Elizabeth M. Cosin/EMC…………....David Platt SMOTHERED……………………. Marlane Gomard Meyer/MGM……...Michael Fields THE FAITHFUL…………………. Stephanie Sengupta/SS…………...Constantine Makris JONES............................Geoffrey Neigher/RB & GN.........Frank Prinzi THE EXTRA MAN………………. Marlane Gomard Meyer/MGM.……...Jean de Segonzac POISON………………………….. Stephanie Sengupta/SS…………...Gloria Muzio THE PARDONER’ TALE……….. Theresa Rebeck/TR……………....Steve Shill THE GOOD DOCTOR…………Geoffrey Neigher/GN…………....Constantine Makris THE ENEMY WITHIN…………. David Black/DB………………....John David Coles THE THIRD HORSEMAN………. Rene Balcer/RB………………....Constantine Makris CRAZY…………………………… Rene Balcer/RB………………....Steve Shill THE INSIDER…………………… Elizabeth M. Cosin/EMC…………....Jan Egleson HOMO HOMINI LUPUS…………Rene Balcer/RB………………....David Platt SEMI-PROFESSIONAL…………Stephanie Sengupta/RB & SS………...…Gloria Muzio PHANTOM…………………………Marlane Gomard Meyer/RB & MGM….......Juan J. Campanella SEIZURE……………………………. Hall Powell/RB & HP…………………...Michael Fields YESTERDAY…………………………Theresa Rebeck/RB & TR…………...…Jean de Segonzac MALEDICTUS………………………..Stephanie Sengupta/RB & SS…….....….Frank Prinzi BADGE………………………………Marlane Gomard Meyer/RB & MGM….......Constantine Makris FAITH……………………………….Theresa Rebeck/RB & TR…………........…Ed Sherin TUXEDO HILL…………………….…Rene Balcer/RB……………….........Steve Shill  Any ideas on how to make proper columns? |
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Post by LOCIfan on Jun 1, 2004 0:07:42 GMT -5
I hope nobody minds, but I've taken the liberty of posting a new thread for each of the writers, other than Rene Balcer, who've contributed episodes to all three seasons of LOCI in the "CREW" thread.
If there are problems with the format or content, moderators please edit or delete at will. It's my hope that we might start to discuss the contributions each individual writer brings to the table.
Best,
LOCIfan
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Post by Observer2 on Jun 1, 2004 16:28:01 GMT -5
A list of all episodes shown so far, with writers and directors (except, oddly, for Jones) can be found at the tvtome.com website, at: www.tvtome.com/LawandOrderCI/season1.html#ep1That’s the page for the first season, with links at the bottom for the other seasons. It even has a page for the fourth season  It lists The Posthumous Collection, Great Barrier and Eosphorus. When I first heard we were getting an episode called Great Barrier, I thought that was a pretty good example of the classic Criminal Intent title, with many possible levels of meanings. But that’s nothing next to Eosphorus! This could get interesting... |
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Post by Observer2 on Jun 1, 2004 17:43:45 GMT -5
Nikki, Thanks for posting the first season... I have some idea of how much work that was! I do have a minor comment on it. On the episodes where Balcer is listed as co-writer of the story, on the credits, he's listed first. You have him listed second. The Writer's Guild has rules about everything (for the writers' protection), and I think whether a co-writer is listed first or second may reflect percentage of input... (it's been a long time since I've actually read any of those rules, so I could be either mistaken or out of date, but I think that's how it goes) So it may be that by changing the order of the credits you may be changing what the credits mean. I know it may seem like a small thing, but I think this board is already becoming a place Criminal Intent fans are aware of, and may look to for reliable information. What can I say? Trisha's a bit compulsive about organizaation -- I'm a bit compulsive about data (especially if it may be slighting my favorite writer! ) |
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Post by NikkiGreen on Jun 1, 2004 18:06:27 GMT -5
Observer, I certainly wouldn't want to slight anyone so I've amended my post by putting Mr. Balcer's name (well, initials actually) first.
I always thought his name came first for either of two reasons; (1) He's the head writer or (2) the names are listed alphabetically.
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Post by NikkiGreen on Jun 1, 2004 18:15:28 GMT -5
It even has a page for the fourth season It lists The Posthumous Collection, Great Barrier and Eosphorus. When I first heard we were getting an episode called Great Barrier, I thought that was a pretty good example of the classic Criminal Intent title, with many possible levels of meanings. But that’s nothing next to Eosphorus! This could get interesting... A blurb from filmjerk.com regarding Eosphorus: www.filmjerk.com/nuke/article927.htmlLaw and Order: Criminal Intent is filming season four’s “Eosphoros,” in which April is caught between her Atheist grandmother and born again father. April is often lost in the shuffle, and stages her own kidnapping for attention, but it goes terribly awry |
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Any ideas on how to make proper columns?
It lists The Posthumous Collection, Great Barrier and Eosphorus.