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Post by Patcat on Nov 21, 2008 15:53:52 GMT -5
First episode of the second season. First aired September 29, 2002. Will air on the USA Network on November 25, 2008 at 12 am (EST) Written by Stephanie Sengtupa and Rene Balcer Directed by Darnell Martin Guest Actors: Jay O. Sanders as Harry Rowan Jim Gaffigan as Russel Matthews Leslie Hendrix as M.E. Rodgers Synopsis: The investigation of a funeral director's death leads Goren and Eames to a hapless director of a crematory and an obsessive compulsive hitman. Quotes: Goren: "Pacemakers have to be removed before cremation. Otherwise, the lithium batteries explode. Gives off a toxic fume and could damage the cremation chamber." Deakins: "Yea...I heard silicone implants had to be removed. My buddy Martinelli in the 3 7 married a stripper." Eames (reacting to Goren's poking of a dead body): "You must've been so much fun in biology class." Goren: "Actually, my biology teacher, Mr. Dixon, didn't think I was much fun at all." Goren: "I need to get my hands to a lab." Eames: "You think he would have remembered if she'd exploded in his oven." Goren: "The hitman who came in from the cold." Goren: "I need to use my most important investigative tool--my library card." Note: Some of this episode is based on the Tri-State Crematory Scandal of February, 2002, where some 200 bodies were discovered unburned in Noble, Georgia. Details of the scandal are at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tri-State_CrematoryQueries: Another "ripped from the headlines" episode. How well does this story use reality as a starting point? In its history, how well does LOCI use headlines? Does it do it better or worse than its L&O siblings? Is this episode exploitive or shocking? Does Rowan's wife have any idea how her husband makes a living? For the scientists among you out there, does Rowan's use of DNA make sense? Will Carver be able to get this one stick? What will happen to Russel Matthews? How much did he know about what Rowan was doing? And what was Bobby Goren like in high school? Comments: Well, there's nothing like the sight of rotting bodies to start off a season, is there? I think this black, black comedy occasionally gets lost among the many excellent episodes of the Second Season. LOCI often has a bleak sense of humor, and it's certainly on display in this story. There's a couple of fine turns by guest actors Jim Gaffigan (I'm proud to claim him as a fellow Hoosier) and Jay O. Sanders. This episode features one of Bobby Goren's best dissections of another human being, and Sanders' depiction of Rowan's disintegration as he desperately searches for a clue that's not there is splendid. And it has my absolute favorite Goren quote of all time (g). Enjoy this episode as you prepare for Thanksgiving and prepare that turkey. Submitted, as always, for your comments and considerations. Patcat
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Post by DonnaJo on Nov 22, 2008 7:32:55 GMT -5
I never tire of watching this episode. To me, it's one of the best ever developed for the series. As good as Jim Gaffigan is, Jay Sanders as Harry is fantastic! A perfect sociopath. I love how he's got that little smile on his face while he's killing the funeral director. Very creepy. The wife? Please. Another woman who chooses to keep her head in the sand. Maybe its unfair to expect her to suspect her hubby is a killer, but I'm sure there were plenty of clues that his so-called job in "sales" wasn't what it seemed. A dim bulb and a perfect spouse for Harry the Hitman. This favorite quote Patcat.....is it the one about the library card? I know many people love it, but for me, that line is another one written for Goren that sounds forced and unnatural when actually spoken. It was important in those early years to let viewers know about Goren's use of the library to solve cases, but it sound so geeky to me. Was that the point, perhaps? That in reality, tall, handsome, clever Det. Robert Goren was really a geek?
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Post by outerbankschick on Nov 22, 2008 11:38:10 GMT -5
I'd have to add that Bobby Goren is the sexiest geek I've ever seen! Jay Sanders is superb at playing "creepy". He did a turn on the Mothership as an extremely exacting father who abused his family without ever raising a hand to them. It was fantastic.
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Post by Patcat on Nov 22, 2008 13:05:58 GMT -5
Oh, I think Bobby Goren was a geek when he was a teen. And I think there's a big part of him that still thinks of himself as a geek. I suspect he was terribly shy and awkward when he was a kid and spent a lot of time living in the library and hiding and living in books. Of course, this could be another case where I'm projecting some of my character on that of Goren (g).
Eames, I suspect, had a more "normal" teenage life. I suspect she wasn't part of the "in" crowd, but very popular, and probably because she was kind to everyone. But she's pretty enough that every once in a while, particularly in the early episodes, Goren seems to look at her as if he can't quite understand what she's doing with him.
Patcat
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Post by quietfireca on Nov 26, 2008 19:09:23 GMT -5
I love this episode! To me it has a little bit of everything. I always have to chuckle when I see Goren and Harry together. Harry makes Goren look small. He’s also another leftie.
There are lots of smiles in the episode: Goren sniffing Russell when they go to the crematory Deakins comments about silicon implants during which time Goren looks at Eames and then puts his head in his hand, the relevance to the case lost to him…. The fellow asking Goren if he’d like his anus stuffed with cotton. I don’t know how VDO managed to keep a straight face…. I wonder if there are any bloopers…. I always chuckle when Eames turns squeamish! (twice in this epi) She’s fine just seeing a body or being near one, it’s when Goren starts poking that her face screws up – and that would include a scene when he’s smelling something on a dog (even innocuous coffee grounds as it turns out) in But Not Forgotten.
Russell Matthews was a pretty flaky, pie in the sky kind of fellow, incapable of any heinous crime. Greedy and callous, I think Goren described him and then looked forward to meeting the real brain behind the murder of the mortician.
When Harry and his wife come into Major Case, I love how Goren uses phrases like Elegant and inspired staging Attention to detail Awe Stroke of genius He just feeds into Harry’s ego. Harry even has the gall to pat himself on the back right in front of Goren with “I wish the police were half as capable as this fellow seems to be”. Arrogant or what?
Then Goren plants the seed of doubt with “The smallest thing can give you away….”
At first I though Eames wasn’t in on the tooth cap game as she sat with Harry in the interview room with a questioning look on her face, as Goren went off with the magnifying glass. But then the look she and Goren give each other as Harry leaves convinces me she is fully aware.
As soon as Goren shows up with the warrant the next morning, Harry knows right away he’s been played. It’s that little smile on his face. That little smile is his glowing ego telling him that he really hadn’t made a mistake….. And in his twisted mind, he is still triumphantly superior.
I wonder how superior he’ll feel as he enjoys the rest of his life in prison?
Here is another epi where they leave Carver out of the loop. Not for as long as in Best Defense, but nevertheless, he’s in the dark. (off on a tangent of realization – by the time Pas de Deux rolls around, he expects something to be up with the two of them, but is watching the wrong detective!!!)
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Post by Moonbeam on Nov 26, 2008 22:36:51 GMT -5
I can help but laugh at Jim Gaffigan and the crematorium. I immediately think of his hot pocket routine!
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susan1212
Detective
Yeah. I get that.
Posts: 444
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Post by susan1212 on Nov 28, 2008 11:05:34 GMT -5
You've considered all the particulars of this one, Quietfire. I love this episode too. It has definitely stood the tests of time and dissection. It has all the elements we love - the "smiles", the challenge for Goren (met superbly), the "play", the masterful result, interspersed with Goren's quirks (the examination of the funeral director's body, the sniffing, and the physicality of his character) and Eames' snarks ("So that's a 'no' on the nature walk."). A classic.
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Post by tjara on Mar 18, 2009 3:53:54 GMT -5
Just saw this Monday...
Well, nothing "special" for me, but lots of fun to watch, and very creepy... Eames being so squeamish was great, and Goren was so oblivious about it... Aw, and Bobby talking about handiwork... hmmmm... I could find things to fix for him around here... LOL... I really liked that comment and it tied in nicely with Bobbie's car hobby - he likes building stuff. And that remark about getting his hands to a lab!! And that huge magnifying glass! What a symbol to use - hello, there's super sleuth!! And how he starts setting up Harry... step by step,... great. Though I would've expected something more when they came to execute the search warrant. The confession seemed awfully silent and so short. I also was surprised that Carver wasn't in the loop, I mean he's present when Bobby says they will set up Harry, isn't he? Will have to go back and check I guess... Sadly though, the victim seemed to get lost a little, but what's more - we never really hear about Harry's intent, do we?? How he comes to doing that job?
Heavens, both Goren and Deakins can quote from the Bible? Maybe it's because I can't, but I thought that was absolutely funny...
Oh, and did anyone else notice Eames in the red, sleeveless shirt at the office? I think that's so funny, I mean Bobby is there in his full suit, and she's sitting next to him in a sleeveless shirt? Maybe she's suffering from hot flashes? I probably wouldn't have noticed if there hadn't been comments about "tank top Season 7", but I really got a chuckle out of that, especially the contrast between the two of them.
Goren seems very geeky in that ep, but I think it's the subject matter... it kinda irks most people, so it pushes him farther off than usual. Because his performance isn't nearly as "geeky" as in some other eps. (Probability comes to mind)
I like geeky Goren though, and what I really like is that VDO can grimace without being concerned about what it'll look like. Some actors, when they grimace, they'll keep the "cool" face, because they want to look "good". VDO doesn't seem to care and I see it in many episodes were Goren does some of the more geeky stuff... it makes Goren so real.
Very, very well. But it's so chilling, so creepy... waah, I don't even want to think about it. Gives me heebie-jeebies...
Another one of those clueless wives. In the early seasons, we see all clueless wifes but no clueless husbands... She really was a little naive... but it's hard to beat Jerry Rankins wife from Phantom.
I'm no scientist, but as far as I know, DNA doesn't feature as prominently in real-life-trials as it does on TV. That's actually changing recently, I think - called the "CSI-effect". Still, DNA is not as "fool-proof" as TV shows make us think.
He probably didn't know about the planting of DNA, but he's definitely up for charges...
I'm with you on this one, PC, I think Bobby was rather geeky. In an attractive way, but still geeky. I'd also expect that his mother's condition this cause quite a few rumors and quite a few not so nice comments.
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Post by Techguy on Mar 19, 2009 2:14:46 GMT -5
"Dead" is yet another gem from Season 2, a superb balance of dark graveyard humor (no pun intended) at the crematorium with an interesting study of a classic sociopath. I really like how Goren plays with the killer's mind to get him to reveal his deeds, which is more than enough to offset the cluelessness of the wife who apparently never once questioned how or where hubby earned the money to afford the nice house and car. This cat-and-mouse mind game is another Goren trait that has been absent in the G/E episodes of recent seasons, and one which I hope will re-emerge once Goren gets his act together.
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Post by tjara on Mar 20, 2009 8:12:42 GMT -5
This one I really blame on you guys!!! All that talk about how Eames likes her coffee... www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VNghga74EkWhich reminds me... my cup is awfully empty right now
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Post by idget on Mar 20, 2009 8:27:08 GMT -5
Wow, it's really weird to hear different voices coming out of Bobby and Alex's mouth. Do they always have the same people dubbing their voices or is it different people for each episode? I love Bobby's voice and I don't think I could get used to hearing someone else speak for him.
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Post by tjara on Mar 20, 2009 9:32:23 GMT -5
Yes, usually they will keep the same person for the dub throughout the run of a series. One of the most notable changes was Jonathan Frakes from Star Trek, who got a new voice for the movies! :LOL: What happens most often is that when you see different movies/series than there will be different people doing it. No less than 9 people have dubbed VDO, and that's beside the Goren voice... Only some of the very famous actors have their dubbed voice and it's always the same person. But we're talking about the likes of Richard Gere, Tom Cruise, Julia Roberts... I always prefer Original versions if I can get them, which is why I just love DVDs
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