DISCUSSION OF THE WEEK: NO EPISODE!!

[Patcat]

So, in looking for possible candidates for this week's episode, I discovered that all were either episodes that were already EOW or were so recent that it seemed too soon to revisit them. So, I thought for this week I'd offer some random questions that have crossed my mind. We've touched on some of these issues in other threads, but I thought some worthy of revisiting. Some of these are pretty obvious, but why not deal with them? I've also tucked the ASP Bat away for a few of these questions. So, enjoy!

Is there a theme to LOCI? Do each of the seasons have a them?

What makes a great LOCI episode? What are the elements of a classic?

Who is your favorite villain? Least favorite?

Who is your favorite guest star? Least favorite?

What's your favorite episode? Least?

Why do you like LOCI? How did you first come to the show?

Who do you miss the most--Deakins or Carver?

What do you think has happened to: Deakins? Carver? Bishop? Logan? Fallaci?

What will happen to Jo and Declan Gage?

Is Bobby visiting Declan in prison?

Is Sebastien still out there?

Where's Donnie?

Who put the rat in Bobby's desk? Are they a danger?

What's going to happen with Bobby and Alex? What do you WANT to happen with them?

Both Alex Eames and Nicole Wallace are small blondes. Comments?

Alex was kidnapped by a woman named Jo and her husband's name was Joe. Comments?

What other detectives (on television, in books, wherever) do you like?

And I apologize to the Wheeler/Nichols fans out there. I don't feel familar with either to address them and their issues. But please feel free to add your own questions and comments.

The EOW will return next week in its usual format.

Patcat

(Techguy and some others may appreciate knowing THE WAR AT HOME was one of the candidates for this week's EOW. I just couldn't face dealing with that one.)

[leanonme]

Patcat,

Great idea!

This is great timing, because I just watched Cherry Red this morning. Classic, and a family favorite. Whenever it is on, everyone wanders into the room. The kids have another snow day today. My daughter loves Lewis, and my son thinks Bobby and Alex look "bad ass" in their " Matrix outfits" ( dark pants, and long dark coats).

I think this may be the near perfect CI episode. Alex has lots of great lines ( today what hit me was "headbangers paradise"), we get some good small tidbits about Bobby's past, Bobby and Carvers playdate, of course the car scene, great aria, and just perfect Goren throughout the episode.

When I say perfect Goren I mean the Goren that is quirky, pushy, smart, compassionate, and cruel all wrapped up in one great, well-dressed package.

While this episode has lots of well-known classic CI moments,what I really noticed today was the empty warehouse scene. The scene is great visually. Big, white, warehouse in the background with Bobby and Alex in all black. But the scene is just compelling, which is saying a lot because, well, its an empty warehouse! But Bobby and Alex circle around each other while Bobby thinks through the evidence. It isn't all the Goren show however, in this scene Alex has a real presence, and Goren seems to be really bouncing things off of her. She seems to be serioulsy considering everything. I just loved it. This may mean nothing, but I found it interesting that at the end of the scene, when Bobby really considers his idea, he is squatting down, looking up at her, as if really questioning her.

I think I remember seeing a clip somewhere which said that they wanted Goren think, but in a way that the audience could see it. It was done brilliantly here.

Season 2... sigh... its the best.

[Patcat]

I wonder who's responsible for the "Choreography" of the some of the scenes. The director? The actors? A combination? There's some wonderful bits in this show.

Patcat

[jeffan]

Patcat wrote:

"How did you first come to the show?"
A. Jeff Goldblum!

"What other detectives (on television, in books, wherever) do you like?"
A. Dorothy L Sayers' Lord Peter Wimsey, especially the stories where he partners Harriet Vane.

"And I apologize to the Wheeler/Nichols fans out there. I don't feel familar with either to address them and their issues."
A. No need, but thank you Petcat. Zach Nichols has yet to have his day!

[tjara]

Oooh... what a topic...

I'm not sure - if there's a general theme to CI, maybe it is that there's always reasons behind a crime, but even the best reasons don't make a crime "right". Somewhere along a lines, not all eps touch upon this.

I'm not sure as to the elements of a classic ep, yet I notice that some of the very good episodes do focus on the "intent" part quite a bit. We get the reason why someone did something...
And since there is this psychological element, Goren messing with people is ever more powerful. Though Eames gets to mess with them too, just today I saw "Jones" - she set him up for Goren...
I guess this is why the eps with a lot of "intent" work so well with me...

I miss Deakins a lot, even though I like Ross. It's just that Deakins was different, quieter, thoughtful, fatherly even - I just like that style a lot.

What other TV detectives do I like? Hmmm... I really enjoy Lilly Rush (Cold Case) a lot. Like Goren she has the ability to get people to confess, though she usually does it by reminding them of their conscience. On the whole Cold Case ist much more of an ensemble show than CI, though.

LOM, thanks for such a wonderful post. Makes me long for all the eps I havn't seen.
I've known CI for a while, but never really watched it. Then I would tune in once or twice "by accident" and then a couple of times "on purpose". I've been hooked since. I like the way they solve a cime, paying attention to the criminal... I like that they care about details without being CSI-like.

I wonder who's responsible for the "Choreography" of the some of the scenes.

I guess it's a collaborative effort. Some things are definitely scripted, but I guess in the beginning there was a lot that the actors added that wasn't actually scripted (Like the Goren lean). Also, they might change stuff that sounds nice on a page but just doesn't work out when acted...

[GorensGirl]

Is there a theme to LOCI? Do each of the seasons have a them?

I don't know about the seasons, but a theme always seemed to be Goren messing with the killer's heads in order to get them to confess.

What makes a great LOCI episode? What are the elements of a classic?

For me the friendship between Goren and Eames, Eames sarcasm and Goren's interrogation techniques, and not guessing the killer till the end.

Who is your favorite villain? Least favorite?

Least is a tossup between Nicole, Goren's dad, and the professor on the last season finale. Oh, and the doctor who sliced his wife. I think my favorite was Charles Rocket's character.

Who is your favorite guest star? Least favorite?

Least favorite was the actress in season two or three who was trying to make a comeback and ended up being the killer. And the guy who played Dr. Monotti.

I really enjoyed seeing Charles Rocket and Alison Pill again.

What's your favorite episode? Least?

My least favorite is anything gory, which I usually turn off partway through. Right now my favorite is probably Amends, but I've got lots that I'm not remembering.

Why do you like LOCI? How did you first come to the show?

Who do you miss the most--Deakins or Carver?

Deakins. I adored both actors, but I spent every other episode wanting to scream at Carver, whereas I always loved Deakins.

What do you think has happened to: Deakins? Carver? Bishop? Logan? Fallaci?

I think Carver is still a D.A. and we just don't actually ever see him anymore. I think Deakins is doing a lot of volunteer work in mentoring programs for some reason. Bishop is probably working with I.A. by now. Logan has probably left the city and moved somewhere and will end up becoming a reluctant amateur sleuth. Falacci is probably on disciplinary leave for mouthing off her supervisor, going out of line with a suspect, or annoying another law enforcement agent she was supposed to actually be cooperating with.

What will happen to Jo and Declan Gage?

Is Bobby visiting Declan in prison?

Is Sebastien still out there?

I don't remember Sebastien and I don't know enough of the Jo & Declan storyline, because I missed the first ep with them.

Where's Donnie?

Probably in another part of the country and hopefully meeting a nice girl who can be a real family member to him.

Who put the rat in Bobby's desk? Are they a danger?

Realistically I could see them causing problems. Unfortunately I have a bad feeling they're just going to fall into a plot black hole with Carver to never be seen again.

What's going to happen with Bobby and Alex? What do you WANT to happen with them?

Both Alex Eames and Nicole Wallace are small blondes. Comments?

I think it was a coincidence at first, but a welcome one when they turned her into more of Goren's arch nemesis.

Alex was kidnapped by a woman named Jo and her husband's name was Joe. Comments?

The writer should have done a better job with that:)

What other detectives (on television, in books, wherever) do you like?

I've loved Father Dowling Mysteries, NCIS, Remington Steele, Diagnosis Murder, Flashpoint and The Mentalist. Oh, and Thomas Pitt from The Cater Street Hangman.

For books most of the detectives I like are amateur sleuths, like in Mary Higgins Clark novels. US Marshall Marcus O'Malley in the Dee Henderson novels is an exception.

[deathroe]

Oooh, I'll play ...
**

Is there a theme to LOCI? Do each of the seasons have a theme?
Apart from the second season broaching Nicole and the latest seasons relating "the destruction of Bobby Goren," search me. Four in particular is very dark. Sometimes I wonder if the darkness is what
has undone the series, as much as anything else.

What makes a great LOCI episode? What are the elements of a classic? Wit, satisfying convolution, a satisfying explanation. Great characters down to the minor characters.

Who is your favorite villain? Least favorite? Wally. Nicole.

Who is your favorite guest star? Least favorite? I liked the Claire Bloom spot, and Stephen Gross was wonderfully creepy. Minnelli was enjoyable (she is such a smart person), and Brooke Shields annoyed me as much as ever.

What's your favorite episode? Least? Favorite--take a guess , although I'm also partial to "Silver Lining," "Brother's Keeper," and many, many others. I find the first raft of Logan episodes to be particularly underrated ("To The Bone").

Why do you like LOCI? How did you first come to the show? In my last years of grad school, I started watching crime dramas at random, and Bobby G stuck.

Who do you miss the most--Deakins or Carver? Neither, really--I just wish they'd replaced Carver.

What do you think has happened to: The only one that interests me is Logan, and I wonder if he won't come back to one of the franchise shows at some point.

What will happen to Jo and Declan Gage? I prefer not to think about that.

Is Bobby visiting Declan in prison? It wouldn't surprise me; the question to me is more if he's transcended that relationship.

Is Sebastien still out there? Don't give the writers any ideas

Where's Donnie? I have a feeling we'll find out.

Who put the rat in Bobby's desk? Are they a danger? I don't know. Cops in league with Testarossa?

What's going to happen with Bobby and Alex? What do you WANT to happen with them? Ship ship ship ... and actually, it wouldn't surprise me if they at the very least kept the tortured non-love story on its current level.

Both Alex Eames and Nicole Wallace are small blondes. Eames/Erbe really is a brunette, and I'm not sure how similar they are, really. I think that one of the ways in which Eames works is as a foil for Nicole and/or Mama G ("does she remind you of your mother?")

Alex was kidnapped by a woman named Jo and her husband's name was Joe. Comments? They weren't thinking. Leight didn't know that Eames was widowed, for a while there.

What other detectives (on television, in books, wherever) do you like? Perry Mason (the one in the books and the one on television). I just read a Fred Vargas novel recently, and I really liked that

[Patcat]

I appreciate people responding to this discussion. I was afraid people might find it a bit elementary school.

Patcat

[tjara]

The only one that interests me is Logan, and I wonder if he won't come back to one of the franchise shows at some point.

Really? How's that?
(Just curious because I don't see that happening)

They weren't thinking. Leight didn't know that Eames was widowed, for a while there.

Huh? Hadn't that been mentioned before? I'm sure Leight knew, he just wasn't paying attention (what really has the same effect). As far as the husbands name, that could've been chosen way before the Jo Declan story arc or just be a coincidence. Either way I'd not over-analyze it, Joe is a pretty common name.
Btw. - is Eames Alex maiden name oder married name?

[deathroe]

Tjara,

(1) I think that they left the door open for Logan to come back in that last episode. That's JMO from the writing (I just like to study the show. I do not have inside knowledge

(2) I regret that I don't have time to dig for it right now, but there is a press reference to Warren Leight not having known that Eames was a widow. In "Amends," we learn that Eames kept her maiden name. Her husband's name was "Joe Dutton."

[tjara]

on (2) - jeeeez, how could they hire someone that didn't familiarize himself with the show... A huge no-no for me.

And thanks, sure - his name was Joe Dutton. I actually knew that, but didn't make the connection. Stupid me, I guess I'm going straight back to bed, I have a cold.

[LO:CI]

What makes a great LOCI episode? What are the elements of a classic?

Goren and Eames


Who is your favorite villain? Least favorite?

Wally / Nicole


Who is your favorite guest star? Least favorite?

/ Olivia D'abo


What's your favorite episode? Least?

Too many to chose / Untethered


Who do you miss the most--Deakins or Carver?

Probably Deakins, though I miss Carver a lot, too


Is Bobby visiting Declan in prison?

No.


What's going to happen with Bobby and Alex? What do you WANT to happen with them?

I want the to be such a good team as they used to be. No idea what will really happen


Both Alex Eames and Nicole Wallace are small blondes. Comments?

Eames is not really blond for me.


Alex was kidnapped by a woman named Jo and her husband's name was Joe. Comments?

Coincident.


What other detectives (on television, in books, wherever) do you like?

I occasionally watch CSI:NY

[ZackNicholsgirl]

Why do you like LOCI? How did you first come to the show?


The reason: a 6'4" Man...

[tjara]

The reason: a 6'4" Man...

Robert Goren!
Who else could you be talking about???

[ragincajun]

Is there a theme to LOCI? Do each of the seasons have a them?

I think this last two season seemed to, since it got into the breaking down of Goren. But I didn't see it in the beginning.

What makes a great LOCI episode? What are the elements of a classic?

I actually feel, when Goren and Eames really click together.

Who is your favorite villain? Least favorite?

lol, Nicole and Nicole, I really don't like how they handled her. But I don't want her to come back either.

Who is your favorite guest star? Least favorite?

I would really like to see Neil Patrick Harris come back, but of course he couldn't play the same person. Least Fav? DR. Stern who ever played him.

What's your favorite episode? Least? Fav, Cherry Red. Least, Happy Family.

Why do you like LOCI? How did you first come to the show?

First like it I don't remember, but just started watching after SVU one time, and got hooked, at first thought Goren was a little too goofy but then he grew on me.

Who do you miss the most--Deakins or Carver?

What do you think has happened to: Deakins? Carver? Bishop? Logan? Fallaci?

What will happen to Jo and Declan Gage?

Guess both will stay locked up.

Is Bobby visiting Declan in prison?

Maybe, but he will forget who Bobby is won't he?

Is Sebastien still out there?

He probably died

Where's Donnie?

On the run I guess, he probably thinks he is still wanted, and his father probably told him not to trust Bobby.

Who put the rat in Bobby's desk? Are they a danger?

Another bad cop, no I don't think they will go beyond the rat.

What's going to happen with Bobby and Alex? What do you WANT to happen with them?

I am a non shipper, it would ruin the partnership. I don't see any chemistry. To Bobby the job is first, I am not sure if he could put anything into a relationship. I think they will continue to be partners until the show is canceled, or one of the actors quit.

Both Alex Eames and Nicole Wallace are small blondes. Comments?

Maybe looks, but personalities totally different.

Alex was kidnapped by a woman named Jo and her husband's name was Joe. Comments?

I don't think it has anything to do with anything.

What other detectives (on television, in books, wherever) do you like?

I watch psych, Monk, I don't read particular detectives novels, but I read those type of books. I also watch the other law and orders.