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Post by Morrigan13 on May 16, 2004 9:18:12 GMT -5
"Gemini" was on USA last night. I gave up logic homework to watch (Goren is more logical than this textbook). I didn't really remember that much from the first time I saw it (in Sept/Oct?) but I must say it was fascinating.
It's always intriguing for me to watch siblings turn on each other. I am an only child, and the whole sibling relationship is an enigma. I would think that two people raised together for eighteen years (at least) would have a better, more loving relationship than Spencer and Brent. Of course, Brent did seem to worship his older brother, but Spencer appeared to sell his younger brother out at every oppurtunity. Or could it be he had tired of bailing him out even at the age of 17? Or was he just a selfish bastard?
Anyway, I have seen siblings act like this before. My father-in-law and his five siblings act in a similar way (just not criminally). Always blaming each other for their problems and constant bickering. I guess after 55 years, it's just a habit.
Thoughts, anyone?
Mo
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Post by DiFiCult on May 16, 2004 17:51:37 GMT -5
;D This is my first post.Thanks for the welcome. Morrigan13 mentioned something about siblings and sibling rivalry. Like everything else, it depends on the family dynamics. My family is dysfunctional, but it's that Finnish Lutheran type of dysfunctional. So, no murders but we might not talk to you for a year or two.
In in-law type of relationships, I've seen cases where there are no boundaries. For this type of family, the anger and the hurts seem so old. And, it's the only way they know how to love. I used to volunteer every Sunday at a shelter for abused women, and it really reinforced to me how some people love. And, the staff really tried to teach the volunteers not to judge.
I'm not a psychology person at all, so my discussion is simply that I think most of us have trouble relating to that type of dysfunction. I sometimes wonder why it fascinates me so much. In a family owned business I know well, the largest source of employee theft is from relatives. It seems justified by the sense that the family hasn't provided "my fair share" so it's stolen from the family. And, it's not that large a sum of money. I just don't get it. It's almost meant to inflict hurt.
I read a book called "Codes of Love" which discusses how childhood dynamics can go into adult relationships. I think Criminal Intent explores the dynamics of dysfunction and most of us are interested into that psychological insight. It's what draws me to Court TV sometimes.
Note to Morrigan13: I'm the first child of two only children. They are both very generous people. But, then again, they didn't have to deal with a bratty younger brother who could teach the CIA something about surveillance. However, hopefully, we all grow up and mostly the love is left. Sorry I rambled.
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Post by Cassie on May 16, 2004 17:55:46 GMT -5
but Spencer appeared to sell his younger brother out at every oppurtunity. Or could it be he had tired of bailing him out even at the age of 17? Or was he just a selfish bastard? I saw the episode again last night, I did think Spencer was nasty towards his younger brother. However, I am not all that sure that Spencer really knew how serious his brother's mental condition was. He seemed a little surprised at the end of the show when Goren was talking about his brothers condition. I think when they were in high school, Spencer was a teen also, and I am sure he was embrassed by his brother behavior. However, Brent's family had plenty of money. They had enough money to allow Brent to get $200. 00 a day out of a Mac machine, from a Trust Fund that was set up for him. Which makes me wonder even more about the parents. They should have known what was really going on with their son and I dont think they did, just by Spencer's attitude towards his brother. Sibling rivary is very common.  There are many books on that subject and birth order. |
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Post by Metella on May 16, 2004 19:03:41 GMT -5
dificult - the first child of two only children .... arguments must be fun  Yes, a lot of research and some of seeming to give significant longterm results on birth order & overall personality type. Welcome to all you newbies- post often. |
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Post by trisha on May 17, 2004 14:50:56 GMT -5
Let me start off by admitting that it has been quite a while since I've seen this one.
I don't know if it is so much that Spencer didn't understand until then that Brent had problems, or his refusal to give Brent a break on anything getting in the way of a deeper realization. The way he saw it, people had been giving Brent breaks his whole life, and though Brent obviously had problems, Spencer wouldn't give him a pass on anything out of pure spite.
This is different spectrum of sibling rivalry than what most of us are used to seeing. Spencer is passive aggressive, while Brent has no idea that any rivalry exists between them at all. Any frustration he feels coming from his brother, he passes off as part of the average emotional range of his brother instead of pondering the possibility that any of his brothers aggression could be directed at him specifically.
Those of us who grew up with a constant rival know how deep the wounds can be. Not many people, if any at all, will ever know us as well as our sibs, and when they use their insights against us, few things can be more damaging.
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Post by DiFiCult on May 20, 2004 23:41:06 GMT -5
Tricia-Very nice, succint way to state what I was trying to say about there being different dynamics for each family. Siblings can be so close that it's fun (a playmate), a comfort, a horrible pain, or a combination at different times.
Betrayal is a complex issue, isn't is? A hot button for families. Someone can't betray you unless they know you. And, I feel it would have to be repetitive to lead to that kind of relationship and that kind of anger.
I haven't decided if the one brother was oblivious or unaware. I know that sounds stange, but, in abusive relationships, there is a sense of knowing and yet not acknowledging the issues to oneself or others. Al-Anon (which I don't completely agree with) teaches that the loved ones will often set the same too high expectations each time (different scenario), while sort of "knowing" that they will be betrayed and the person will drink. I'm not an Al-Anon expert, I just attended to a while during a serious relationship with a man who was a friend of Bill W.
The abused spouses I used to volunteer with had geniune surprise that (1) there was another beating and (2) it was getting more frequent or worse if the family stress increased. The honeymoon to stress to violence to shock/leaving to reunification to honeymoon period was very common. I don't remember Gemini well enough to remember if there was a cycle or just a history.
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There are many books on that subject and birth order. 
