1:21 - "Faith" 2002-04-28

[lawfan]

I missed this episode in the past, just saw pieces of it and looked forward to seeing it in its entirety last night. I thought out of all the shows I've seen, this one wasn't very good and to me so implausible. All these people, publishers, fans, etc. sending money to an email address? The excuses were lame and I thought it bordered on bizarre. Even with a "cult" angle, it was not well done to me. That said, I of course thought that given the material, Goren and Eames did the best they could and made it bearable with some good acting. Was I just in a mood or did anyone else think this was a bit too weird?

[maherjunkie]

I enjoyed this episode. People can be that way, wanting to believe. I thought when Goren asked the girl about menstruation that and the look on Deakins' face made it all worthwhile.

[lawfan]

That was classic and a little unexpected. It was at that point that I thought "in real life" they would of summed it all up faster. Hazards of having a detective family! : )

[Patcat]

H-m-m. I always "bought" the basic idea of this episode, partly because there have been cases like this in real life. Recently we've seen the case of James Frey, whose memoir has been questioned. Often it takes just the presence of one "expert" to verify these things.

I tend to view people like "Barb" to be some of the lowest of the low--not only do they hurt and rip off the people they con, but they also hurt the causes of people who are actually truly harmed in this world.

And I've always found it interesting that "Toby", the male partner, is completely silent. I wonder if he had lines that were cut, or if the original script had him as a mute character.

Patcat

[lawfan]

I thought he seemed a bit "mute" too... maybe they did cut something out.
I agree that things like this are rampant, but my beef was that with people like Frey, he existed and we saw him, he just lied. Mattie Spepanek, the child poet, was real and people gave to him, but there wasn't any mystery. She never existed, never had a birth cert, a picture,a real health report, never was seen on video or TV, or by anyone giving all that money. That, being a natural skeptic, was a bit much. Again, that coupled with being married to a detective who subliminally probably pushed me more that way over the years, it just didn't jive. But, it was one show, and my thoughts weren't the collective, or it wouldn't of been made.

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

Well, when Goren said that that the answer should have been 'whatever is happening to her body, she shouldn't have to think about.' is true, for him to conclude that she was a fake solely based on her reaction to that question was a little premature. She could just as easily have been caught off guard by the bluntness & extreme personal nature of the question & that could've been why she hesitated & then became flustered when he pressed the issue.
Hey, if a stranger I'd never met asked me a question like that over the phone, I would've been flustered too LOL

[cifan]

I agree lawfan, I am not a skeptic by nature, quite the opposite actually, but from the first "excuse" that was made I knew she didn't exist. I found myself practically yelling at Christine for being so blinded.

I know this sort of thing happens a lot... well meaning people being deceived by dishonest frauds, but I think this episode, at least the way it was written was a bit contrived

[kawaiidragonfoe821]

I felt bad for Christine, here she killed for this girl only to find out that she didn't exist. What a blow that must have been to her mental state, I was mildly surprised when she didn't suffer a major emotional breakdown after her concrete belief of the reality of this little girl was shot down in flames. Finding out something like that would certainly weigh on the threads of her sanity & I can only imagine how she felt. She had recently been delivered some devistating information about not being able to have kids of her own; maybe thats why she chose to believe so faithfully in Erica?

[Patcat]

Yes, I found the justifications for Christine's belief to be valid. It's ironic that the girl's story would never have received so much publicity without Christine's efforts--she's the one who took an apparently deeply flawed manuscript and turned it into an apparently well written one. If the con artists had been better writers, there might have been more questions about the girl's existence.

An undeveloped thought (and one others have had); Goren, while a former altar boy who seems skeptical about many thing, does not like people who mess with the faith of other people.

Patcat

[NicoleMarie]

This one shows you just how gullible and stupid people can be. Christine was manipulated and used but she allowed it by ignoring her instincts and common sense.

[maherjunkie]

For once I'm right behind ya, sister girl! You'd think if she showed that much humanity before she would have left the old man alone.

[rosemary]

I didn't feel that this episode was much about religious faith. But as far as religious faith is concerned, I presume that Goren was deliberately created ambigious.

[kismet]

I got to see this for the first time last night, and I was actually fascinated by the psychological manipulation Barb used to pull off this con. I thought it was interesting that she, as Erica, tried to appeal to Alex for help when Bobby starting asking difficult questions. I liked the correlation of the effort to make Alex an ally after the success of making Christine such a fierce defender of "Erica." She appealed to the woman as the more likely source of empathy, but she had also been able to fool two well-educated and seemingly worldly men.

I am curious to know which headline this was ripped from.

[rosemary]

The phone call scene was very interesting. Did you notice that Alex hesitated for an unusually long time when "Erica" asked: "Do you have any children, Alex?" I don't know what was the sense of making her hesitate so long, but when I saw the scene for the first time, I was very curious. Does Alex have any children? Then, when she said "No.", after a long pause, I asked myself…Is she uncomfortable with her not having any children? After I had rewatched the scene a thought came to me that Alex maybe hesitated because she was unsure whether or not she should tell the truth. Anyway, I wondered why "Erica" found that Eames' voice reminded her of her kindergarten teacher. I've never met a kindergarten teacher who talks that butch.

[Jefferaldo]

lawfan said:

I missed this episode in the past, just saw pieces of it and looked forward to seeing it in its entirety last night. I thought out of all the shows I've seen, this one wasn't very good and to me so implausible. All these people, publishers, fans, etc. sending money to an email address? The excuses were lame and I thought it bordered on bizarre. Even with a "cult" angle, it was not well done to me. That said, I of course thought that given the material, Goren and Eames did the best they could and made it bearable with some good acting. Was I just in a mood or did anyone else think this was a bit too weird?

Desperate people do desperate things. This "child" was the only thing they really had. I have not seen this episode in quite a while but I remember enough to know that this happens everyday with every religion. It is all about Faith when you cannot physically see your Gods and when they are made up and controlled by a con artist, the con artist controls you. I am not religious in any way shape or form so there were a few things I didn't quite "get".

These people believed in this little kid like their own kid -- it was really all they had to live for anymore. Lets draw a comparision to Christianity (sorry if this bothers anyone. I chose this because I go to a christian school where I am forced to go to chapel every week when I don't believe so I kind of know all the details). In church people are taught that if they need to be forgiven by Jesus in order to make it to heaven and to eternal life. Faced with the possibility of eternal life, would anyone refuse it? No. People are afraid of their own mortality so they turn to religion to be convinced that there is an afterlife. This child was really their only hope and that is why the woman killed Lafferty (I think that was the name). He disputed her only hope and she was furious.

Anyway I cannot comment further until I watch this episode again. If I am wrong in my comments, its probably because I forgot all the facts.