effie
Detective
off chasing plot bunnies...
Posts: 264
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Post by effie on Nov 1, 2006 15:31:01 GMT -5
BTW, I think whoever suggested the the son was the waiter from "Crazy" might be right. The "Masquerade" credits aren't up yet on IMDB, but the name seems familiar from the credits, as I think I remember thinking it was Eames at first... his name is : Dashiell Eaves
keep your eyes pealed at the credits if you take another look see at the episode to confirm...
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Post by janetcatbird on Nov 1, 2006 15:44:52 GMT -5
It was a good episode. Much closer to CI form, only a couple of weird sound effects ("Sweet and juicy!" just creeped me out), and as I loudly exclaimed to my roommate, "We don't have that damn stalker cam!" Yay!
I really have not seen Liza Minelli in anything, just spoofs, so I was glad that she did it subtle. A mother who grieves, likes the attention but does not seem to be a bad person. (I say "seem to be" because I have my qualms about stage mothers, but at least it wasn't the beauty pageant.) I especially liked her with Jamie at the end--she realized that he was a scared kid at the time, and she felt the same concern and emotions that anybody would feel when their child's friend, a kid they had watched grow up, was in trouble. I know that my parents' co-workers/Sunday School class mates would be worried about me if anything happened so I liked that bit.
Nate's face at the end seemed almost Gumby--conveyed the emotions, but more physical than I'm used to seeing Someobdy mentioned he was a mime? THat'd be it. I did manage to peg him about 2/3 through, but we got character psychology! Picking up on mindset, emotions, the aria! I didn't realize how much I'd missed it.
Kudos to casting on finding such a skeezy looking Fife. Ewwww!!! There are some nasty sick people in the world, and I'm glad they mentioned the monitored program so they weren't flinging him back on the public. And we find out Eames has at least two nieces, so yay for subtle personal tidbits.
I'm with Techguy, the genie/harem girl costume was just wrong. Was her top see-through? I'm sorry, that is just too skanky for any little girl to be wearing.
I love Ross. It still miss Deakins, but he's a new type of personality, who gives as good as he gets. I imagine it probably is realistic of him to be annoyed with Goren (and to a lesser extent Eames) and unorthodox tactics, but they do have the same good basic motives deep down. I loved the little sly look at "Call Faith Yancey's office, tell her it's the DA". Heh!
The Halloween decorations at the precinct surprised me, it seemed almost like they were beating it into you "It's Halloween!". I mean, a pumpkin on the wall isn't too over the top, but I would have expected it more in the snack room than out in public like that.
I actually didn't tape this episode, grumble, but I'll try to write back later.
--Catbird
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mimi
Detective
Posts: 231
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Post by mimi on Nov 1, 2006 15:47:28 GMT -5
From what I remember of Liza - she was vibrant and different than this character and under that framework; I thought she did a great job of the good but weird and needy mother. I think that's what bugged me. The discrepancy on how she usually presents herself and how she portrayed Beth caught me off guard. It was hard to separate the two, Minelli's bombastic behaviors, doubled with Patsy Ramsay's strange behaviors rolled out in my mind and what I saw and heard on screen didn't fit. When an artist is in itself a character it's hard to forget the persona and let the character in. With some exceptions, I usually don't like to watch theatrical actors on TV, I watch them with the apprehension that they will try to play the character for the viewers sitting in the last row...which doesn't exist, except in their mind.
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Post by SarahIvy on Nov 1, 2006 16:08:08 GMT -5
Firstly, LIZA! (Her name should always be said with exclamation and accompanied by jazz hands whenever possible. Love her.)
I thought she did a great understated job, and at the end when she so readily forgave the son...sheesh, it made me feel weepy. I really liked that she was very messed up, but obviously a good person who had truly loved her daughter (my feelings about stage mothers temporarily put aside). She just seemed so fragile and small at the end.
LOVED when they showed up to question Beth, and Goren got roped into having dinner alone with her. Hah! Eames' "Call me if you need a ride" and the look he gave her in return gave me a good laugh. I suspect it must have been Goren who called Beth from the station to tell her they needed to talk, and in her excitement Beth just ran with the idea that it would be him alone....her puffing away on her ciggy and singing while reheating that purchased hunk of meat was priceless.
Man, Goren and Ross were having problems the whole hour, weren't they? There was that great little moment later in the episode when Ross opened a soda can while Goren was talking and he clammed up and got all disgruntled at being interrupted. Gave me a chuckle.
Oh, oh, and I'm so tickled that they brought back their fake Nancy Grace character (Faith Yancy...hee!), she's so obnoxious and awful and I love them for making fun of her.
Overall I really enjoyed this episode and I think it may be my favorite Goren/Eames episode so far this season. It seemed to have a lot more of the old CI elements that I've felt were lacking. Watching Goren peel back the layers and discover Nate's true motivation was wonderful to see.
Frivolous Sidenote: I thought Eames looked very pretty in that soft white sweater...they put her in all dark black and grey too often.
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effie
Detective
off chasing plot bunnies...
Posts: 264
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Post by effie on Nov 1, 2006 16:27:37 GMT -5
not to mention how creepy to hear the "sweet and juicy" voiceover while watching Fife chow down on a hot dog!! Yikes!!
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Post by miranda12 on Nov 1, 2006 16:48:25 GMT -5
I thought this was the best ep of the season - and I agree that this season rocks compared to previous seasons.
Loved Liza playing the crazy, needy, woman, starved for male attention (talk about type-casting) but thought she was really riveting. Actually, they were all great - Fife was even creepier than the real John Mark Carr (and btw, they did bring him back from Asia in business class) and Bill Irwin and son were fantastic. It really does seem as though this year they are getting high-profile fantastic guest stars. Maybe the meatier, more emotional roles are more attractive to the stars.
I have to say, I appreciate the focus on character rather than the twisted plots – maybe I’m not as smart as some of you but in previous years, half the time, the criminals felt like red herrings and just unbelievable that anyone would be able to solve based on the clues provided.
For this one, I didn’t see it coming that it was Nate. I’m also glad that they didn’t make Beth the killer but I actually thought it was going to be the son up until the end so it’s nice to have the plots less muddy but still not predictable.
I definitely thought that Goren and Eames went to Beth's house to "question" her, but, her own desperation probably twisted Goren's call into thinking it was a "date" so at the door, Eames called the audible and left- also fits in with the Captain's order to do what you need to do to gain the suspect's trust and get them to talk.
I also really enjoy the interaction with the Captain and the detectives - he is much tougher but who wouldn't be territorial coming into a new job and inheriting a staff like that? I think the personality "clashes" are much more interesting to watch than the bland lines about gathering evidence of the past.
Finally, another thing about this season is that do you notice how fast the stories get "ripped from the headlines" - Carr was just brought back from Bangkok last month or so and the Christy Brinkley thing seemed really current as well. Maybe a Mark Foley scandal will pop up for Christmas??? These guys work fast!
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Post by trisha on Nov 1, 2006 17:24:11 GMT -5
Summerfield, I'm with you on Goren plying alcohol, and that shot of him pouring for Fife on Faith Yancey's show ... I expected some comment at least from her.
I also thought Liza was great. The whole scene with her "preparing" dinner was a hoot, and her reaction to seeing Eames at the door and then practically dragging Goren in and slamming the door in her face!
That was the only really memorable part for me. The rest, to quote Nikki, was "meh." The plot was a little too obvious and VDO looked really bad. It was hard to look at him.
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j2g
Rookie
Posts: 11
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Post by j2g on Nov 1, 2006 18:11:07 GMT -5
I don't think anyone's mentioned the mystery ADA yet - who was that? Did they have a different ADA because this wasn't originally a MCS case? That said, she's more than welcome to return anytime.
My only complaint is that I couldn't get the thought that "this is the JonBenet Ramsay case." When CI has done ripped from the headlines before, it's usually twists the story around so you almost forget the source material ("Pravda" being the best example I can think of). Not so tonight.
However, a minor quibble. This was well acted, and with enough twists that I wasn't sure where it was going.
Joe
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Post by sarahlee on Nov 1, 2006 19:31:59 GMT -5
...and VDO looked really bad. It was hard to look at him. I went over to thereel and checked out the screencaps, just to make sure I'm not obsessing over the imaginary again, and I'm still worried. VDO doesn't look healthy. I hope it's just set dressing...
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Post by gorensdoppelganger on Nov 1, 2006 19:38:04 GMT -5
It depends on which picture and scene in the episode. He always has red eyes, but in some scenes his eyes are more puffy and he looks tired.
Someone else stated that Mr. D'Onofrio could be acting that part, he traveled to Vietnam without any notice and then is expected to solve the case in 24 hours, hey that would make me tired. The other issue of course would be Goren's concern for his mother's current cancer illness.
It could also be that on a particular filming day the man himself was tired. Even those it's a lighter filming load as far as episodes, it's still a hard and demanding schedule and emotionally stressful on the actor. Who knows how long the shooting days lasted? Just my two cents.
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peachybc
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 109
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Post by peachybc on Nov 1, 2006 19:44:06 GMT -5
The rest, to quote Nikki, was "meh." The plot was a little too obvious and VDO looked really bad. It was hard to look at him. Ditto to both of these comments. I haven't been that impressed with any episode so far in season six. Although I did like "Blind Spot." I'm trying hard to convince myself that VDO's appearance is all part of character portrayal/Goren mind set as I mentioned in an earlier post...but there's a nagging concern I can't shake because VDO doesn't look well to me either.
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Post by sarahlee on Nov 1, 2006 19:53:56 GMT -5
I'm trying hard to convince myself that VDO's appearance is all part of character portrayal/Goren mind set as I mentioned in an earlier post...but there's a nagging concern I can't shake because VDO doesn't look well to me either. I know...it's silly to care, but I hope it's all just "living the part".
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Post by Cassie on Nov 1, 2006 20:53:18 GMT -5
Summerfield, I'm with you on Goren plying alcohol, and that shot of him pouring for Fife on Faith Yancey's show ... I expected some comment at least from her. Forgive me, if you both already know this.... but when John Mark Karr was being taken back from the Philippines, they were feeding him booze to help loosen his lips. That was ripped from the headlines Or Are you saying that that technique was not a Goren maneuver? Also, I am wondering IF in real life, the police use Nancy Grace the way Ross put a call into Yancy Faith Oh the Rookie cop, did anyone notice who she was? She was Kristin Rohde, who played convict Doris, Spencers sister who smashed his marbles in "The Posthomous Collection". Season 3. She was awesome in that role ;D. She also was in the "Subway" episode of Homicide, Life on the Streets with VDO.. She played a cop. I also wonder if the show focused more on the personality of Fife would we have been more satisfied learning about the likes of him. Then reliving the JonBennet Ramsey saga. I thought Liza gave a brillaint performance, but my heart still aches for the Ramseys. its still a fresh wound for them, especially after this past summer's chapter
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Post by raeangel319 on Nov 1, 2006 21:46:18 GMT -5
Man, Goren and Ross were having problems the whole hour, weren't they? There was that great little moment later in the episode when Ross opened a soda can while Goren was talking and he clammed up and got all disgruntled at being interrupted. Gave me a chuckle. i'm rewatching the episode now (in between reading and commenting on this board) and watched this scene right after i read others talking about how VDO/Goren isn't looking so well...got me thinking.... do you notice lately that when goren, eames and ross are walking and talking...it's always ross and eames talking..and goren trailing along behind them. like...ALWAYS. something in that makes me think that maybe it's goren that's no looking so good...and not VDO. i can't tell for sure...but that's my thought. it's like goren is trailing along not really in the conversation...but still knows what's going on. it just seems consistent with stress/depression. and i noticed that he stopped abruptly too when ross opened the pop can. just thought maybe goren got momentarily distracted (easily distracted could also be a symptom of stress/depression) i still agree that eames didn't think the case was botched cuz it was a woman that responded. she's just saying that everyone else seemed to think that, and it made it harder for future women cops. the part about "why didn't teh rookie cop call in detectives".....i think she DID later call backup didn't she? it's just that by then the crime scene had been trampled...not secured. didn't matter if she'd called others or not by then...that can't go back and secure it after the fact. the rookie didn't believe her...that's why she didn't call backup earlier. and did she say she went there with a partner? don't cops sometimes go out alone? hmm..maybe not in NYC though huh? like when eames gets all protective of beth at the end...arm around her and...holding her hand?...when whosit...(jamey's dad?)....is getting outed! then at the end goren is standing rather protectively behind beth.... i'm sure i have more to say...but i can't ever remember it all at once....lol!!!
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Post by Techguy on Nov 1, 2006 21:58:24 GMT -5
It really does seem as though this year they are getting high-profile fantastic guest stars. Maybe the meatier, more emotional roles are more attractive to the stars. Or maybe CI is going after more high-profile guest stars to make it more appealing to viewers when it goes opposite "House."
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