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Post by Cassie on Jun 18, 2005 10:15:09 GMT -5
I have been thinking about Goren and that exchange with Eames on the credit cards. Where some of you saw him as being rude and condescending . I see it more as him being personable with Eames. Where they could talk about anything, bounce ideas off of each other. In Season One, I see Goren as an easy guy to talk and joke with, while as the years have gone by, I see him more serious and aloof towards the people he meets. Almost like they are two different people.
Eames? I am not sure, I think she started out as his sidekick. After Goren and Eames where talking to the man about the blueprints that Gia had borrowed. While walking away from the counter. Eames phone rings. She stops. But the whole visual aspect of that scene. The way they used the camera, (you could see the water stains on the ceiling panels and still see the floor) shows the difference in the height of Goren and Eames. The Mutt and Jeff of their relationship. I just got the feeling that they (the producers ) wanted to drive home to the viewers how tiny she was next to him, even while wearing heels.
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Post by Techguy on Jun 18, 2005 13:34:33 GMT -5
It is interesting to go back and watch the older episodes, especially in light of what we know comes afterward, and most especially in light of the Stephanie SenGupta interview.
I watched this episode again, and then the scene again that was commented on earlier in this thread, about a possible condescending comment by Det. Goren to Eames. I admit it might seem a bit rude at first, but given Ms. SenGupta's comment that Eames is Goren's senior in both the NYPD and MCS, I find it hard to believe he would be in any way denigrating to his senior partner.
I agree with Observer, Goren's comment is not about asking Eames if it's all right with her if the perps steal, it's a comment asking if she finds anything strange or bizarre in the perps' maxing out credit cards after just having pulled off a multi million dollar jewel heist. He seems to be going through a mental process of "profiling" and the actions of the perps don't jibe with the known facts of the case. He might be checking with her if she has anything to add based on her "by the book" approach to lend credence to his deduction--or not as might be the case.
This scene and the episode in general does an excellent job of developing the Goren and Eames characters and establishing their professional relationship, showing the strengths each brings to the partnership. An excellent foundation for what comes later in the series.
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Post by LOCIfan on Jun 18, 2005 17:40:16 GMT -5
Finally had a chance to rewatch this episode for the first time in quite a while. Like Techguy, I felt I had more insight into the characters after reading the interview with Ms. SenGupta.
In our interview, I remember there was a question where someone asked how Goren's changed over the course of the series, and her response was that he's not "as socially awkward and not as overtly quirky." To me, that indicates that in the earliest episodes Goren was deliberately written as socially awkward, which would explain his interaction with Eames regarding the credit card charges. While his intent may not have been to be rude, it can come off that way, and does point to someone who's a bit socially awkward.
That exchange also fits in with what Ms. SenGupta described as Goren's "quirky style of concentration" when working out some aspect of a case. He's more focussed on concentrating on profiling the criminals than on whether or not he's being polite to his partner.
This episode is really fascinating in the way it begins to define and distinguish Goren and Eames. While Goren's the more esoteric, crazy professor type, Eames is definitely the down-and-dirty, street smarts one.
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Post by NicoleMarie on Jun 22, 2005 18:43:25 GMT -5
Do I wanna kick this horse again? Yep, I do. hehehe
Condenscending, that's the word I was looking for. I don't mean Goren was being a wanker on purpose in season 1 though. Goren lightened up by season 2.
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Post by Sirenna on Jul 22, 2005 17:38:47 GMT -5
I got hooked on the show mid-way through the second season. Later I got a chance, thanks to a kind dear person who shall remain anon, to watch a tape of the first season. and I must admit, I'm not sure I'd have stayed a fan had I seen the first season first. It's not his weirdness that turned me off a bit. It was his sheer awkwardness, socially and physically. It all made me find it hard to believe that he was a good a detective as his character is meant to be.
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Post by maherjunkie on Oct 2, 2005 13:49:13 GMT -5
I love the awkwardness! Especially physically. It was not clear to me how the perps found their way to the couple's house. Can anyone help?
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Post by Beaglebabes on Oct 2, 2005 17:52:28 GMT -5
It was great to see this episode again. It really made me want to pull out the season 1 dvds and start watching but I don't have to since the marathon is showing them. Yeah!!
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Post by joanie on Oct 2, 2005 19:09:15 GMT -5
This was a great episode. The scene when Goren tells Gia she has aids was perfect. The actress conveyed her characters thoughts without even speaking. She sat there saying virtually nothing and yet you could read her every emotion through her body language and eyes. I've always liked Vincents old teeth better then the Hollywood perfect whites. I even liked the funky off colored one in the corner.  J. |
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javawolf
Rookie
Scatter poems on the floor. Turn the poet out the door.
Posts: 16
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Post by javawolf on Oct 2, 2005 19:33:31 GMT -5
I've always watched the show with my mother, (young person here--not to be taken seriously) and she's one of those extremely observant people. She's always paying attention to Vincent's appearance. She freaks out when his teeth aren't perfect, or his hair isn't how she likes it. (She HATES the long and curly look he had in 'Want'.) It's funny. I don't know why I posted that here, but I was reminded.
On the subject of 'One,' I enjoyed the episode, but I didn't think it one of the best. I personally, love Goren's quirkiness, and as quirky as he was in this particular episode, it still wasn't enough. Speaking only for myself.
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Duet
Silver Shield Investigator
Bing.... Reality.
Posts: 129
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Post by Duet on Jan 7, 2006 0:26:59 GMT -5
Having just seen One for the first time ever, I'm left with a nagging question.....Did Deakens refer to Goren when he was "telling him off" as Det. 1st grade? If Goren was only 1st gr. has he risen higher since and has that been made mention of in later eps?
After seeing the last few seasons and now finally the first episode one of the impressions I have gotten is that Eames and Goren are brand new partners. This doesn't play out like it was thier first case, but one early in the partnership.
Were would I find the interview spoken of above?
Found it.....facinating! They are both only 1st gr?!! One would think that considering thier ages and expieriece, let alone their admission into MCS, that they would be of a higher rank?
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Post by Patcat on Jan 7, 2006 1:14:19 GMT -5
First Grade is the highest detective rank.
The NYPD works (roughly) on a two-tier system. One can move up through the ranks by taking exams to be a sergeant, lieutenant, captain, inspector, etc. Only so many of these upward moves are available, and after exam results, politics plays a huge role.
The move to detective is supposedly based on merit, and goes third grade, second grade, and first grade. Upon reaching detective, the officer receives a gold shield.
Patcat
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Post by rosemary on Jan 7, 2006 10:20:33 GMT -5
That's true. But if detective 1st grade ist the highest rank, how can Eames have a higher rank (as it has been stated in this thread earlier)? I tried the NYPDs page, but they only explain that all detectives have the same rank "although seniority is respected". What is the difference between having a higher rank and having seniority?
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Duet
Silver Shield Investigator
Bing.... Reality.
Posts: 129
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Post by Duet on Jan 7, 2006 23:21:22 GMT -5
Rank would out rule seniority unless the 2 individuals were of the same rank then I think seniority would play a part.
I find it interesting the the NYPD has no detective ranking system, seems very odd to me.
I also am amazed that there is no set standered accross the country in reguards to detective ranking. A series of books I've been reading has a detective in it based in L.A. who is a Det.3rd gr. In the books this rank has been presented as the highest rank for the LAPD Detectives of Homicide. Hence why I was befuddled as to why Goren after what 15? 20? yrs of service, and with a mind like his, would be just out of uniform and only 1st gr?!! To me there is something odd with that picture.
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Post by Patcat on Jan 8, 2006 1:20:08 GMT -5
Third grade is the lowest grade for a detective in the NYPD; first is the highest.
Both Goren and Eames are First Grade detectives, but Eames attained First Grade before Goren, so she technically outranks him.
Patcat
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Post by maherjunkie on Jan 8, 2006 12:24:04 GMT -5
Will someone please tell me how they target this couple to begin with? I 've watched this episode what feels like a hundred times and I must blink. I know they send them on some phony vacation but why them to begin with?
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Patrick Roy, 2006 inductee into the Hockey Hall of Fame
