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Post by Beaglebabes on Oct 3, 2005 8:37:44 GMT -5
I couldn't even bring myself to watch this episode. I didn't like the Logan charachter the first time around and after reading everyone else's thoughts on the show I guess I did not miss anything.
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Post by LOCIfan on Oct 3, 2005 9:09:11 GMT -5
the bland blah dull introduction to the Barek character as played by Annabella Sciorra. I don't think she changed her facial expression or the inflection of her voice at all. Techguy, you're so right about the lack of facial expression and vocal inflection. I watched this episode again last night and that's what I noticed most of all from Sciorra. There was no expression on her face at all. And her voice remained toneless and flat throughout. That doesn't read as "quirky" to me. It reads as disinterested. It's almost as though she was sleepwalking through the role.
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Post by LOCIfan on Oct 3, 2005 9:15:26 GMT -5
I also felt it was a bit too soon for Barek to bring up Logan's past and how his mother got him to buy liquor for her. Although the tactic worked in getting the perp to realize what his own mother had done to him, this type of revelation was a bit abrupt so early on in the Logan/Barek partnership. He's still trying to prove he belongs in MCS, so to have her bring out this skeleton from his closet so early didn't ring true for me. To be fair, this was not new info for those familiar with Logan's character. When Logan was on the mother ship, it was well known that his mom was a drunk who used to make him buy her booze and who beat the crap out of him at every opportunity. (He was also abused by a priest -- thankfully, they saved that skeleton for later.) But, it did seem too soon in THIS series for an issue to be made of his crummy childhood. But it may also have been an attempt to remind viewers who may have forgotten about Logan's past.
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Post by Metella on Oct 3, 2005 9:29:43 GMT -5
Did no one see the shot of Goren walking past in the background? That is a tidbit I thought you guys would have picked up on.
I'm neutral on this episode: Logan was fine, trying to be low key on purpose, I would suppose & will ease into his character later. Berek had no excuse of easing into her character, she let be known she had worked in MC for a long time solo ..... she could have had bumps with Logan, but should have showed out better at the crime scenes.
I'm really not fond of the two different intro sections.... if this is CI; not CI-Goren CI-Logan; then they should have one opening for all episodes. It is cutting it off too much. There are SVU shows in which not all cast members a part of; true this one is even more partitioned, but it is also the same show and that really pulled me out right at the begining - "hey this is a different show" yuck.
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Post by trisha on Oct 3, 2005 9:37:15 GMT -5
ITA on the intro. They should definitely have just one.
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Post by janetcatbird on Oct 3, 2005 10:21:37 GMT -5
Looks like I am THE minority on this one--so Barek was toned down. Maybe that's her character, in a new situation she's more reserved, and once the character gets comfortable she'll loosen up a bit. Shoot, I'm the same way, and I talk to myself. (Personally I think the thinking-out-loud was a bit overdone, but once they establish her maybe it'll ease up.) Besides, maybe the character is meant to be even-keeled and low-key, a lot of people in the real world are that way. As to Barek, with everyone concerned about Logan, the last thing she wants is to create more complications. (As I have not seen Annabelle Sciorra in anything I can't really say if it's the actress or not.)
But didn't people say similar stuff about Bishop back in season 3, only to look back and say "Well, she wasn't Eames and that's what we didn't like?" I think a lot of this is "She's not Goren!" Well, duh--as people on this board seem so fond of pointing out, Goren is one-of-a-kind. I like the contrast, for the one and only episode we've seen so far. As I said before, give it time. I'm not saying I don't prefer Goren/Eames, but a new dynamic is interesting.
I didn't despise the characters, but I thought the story itself was, well, middling. And I hated the camerawork/music during the robbery scenes. That mother was a piece of work, though, wasn't she? As to the language of "retarded" vs. "disabled", you would expect certain characters who aren't sensitive to use the "retarded" term (the coworkers, junkies, etc.), even Logan has never been known for being PC. But you would expect Barek or someone else in the system to know better.
Metella--no, I didn't see Goren in the background, and I was looking for him and Eames. But it makes sense they'd be floating through the police station, a nice touch.
Am I the only one who noticed the Lenny mention? Or Deakins' walking?
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Post by mimi1802 on Oct 3, 2005 10:57:32 GMT -5
So-so episode on the topic matter; but nicely done on the establishing of a relationship.
I was happy that Barek was different from Goren. I agree with you Janet that using a calm demeanour was a good choice because it's always easier to add elements to a character’s personality than to tone it down. And just a reminder, Sciorra didn't have a whole lot of time to get acquainted with the character, so she'll have to do it during the episodes instead of before.
Character-wise, staying low-key was also an excellent choice. I felt the episode was like a boxing match where the two boxers were sizing up one another. Yet, Logan knows about his reputation and played with it during the interrogation scene with the drug dealer and with the jewels reseller.
The scene where Sciorra forces Logan to talk about his past to get to the son was very risky but she saw a window of opportunity and she took it, and Logan did confide to Barek about his mother (always loved Logan and his puns: Rum-punch was a good one), she just made the obvious association between what he told her and his behaviours. In the long run, Barek's demeanour will have a positive effect on Logan. Both detectives will always be on their toes. Logan will always test how far he can go and Barek will carry this aura of calmness which can only be beneficial to Logan.
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Post by Sirenna on Oct 3, 2005 11:01:53 GMT -5
There was no chemistry in this episode either between Logan and Barek or between them and us, the viewers.
Also why was this a major case case? It seemed like two junkies with a gun and the desparation to use it, that's all.
I miss the sense of humour behind the show.
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Post by Sirenna on Oct 3, 2005 11:03:00 GMT -5
I thoght I caught a glimpse of Eame' back and red bob. She was in the squad room sitting on the edge of someone's desk.
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Post by BegToDiffer on Oct 3, 2005 11:15:25 GMT -5
Just another cop show to me. Nothing made it stand out. The only thing that resembled "Criminal Intent" was the appearance of Deakins and Carver.
Barek was a huge disappointment. I never expected her to be a female Goren, but I sure thought there would be more substance to her than there was. And to add to that wish list, how about a personality? Then there is that hair. Just what we need, more stringy hair.
I also think the two intro openings will confuse viewers. Obviously some viewers are not aware of the additional cast members and may not even bother to watch if they think Goren and Eames are gone.
Logan was just what I expected. When Barek made the suggestion that he share details about his mother, I couldn't believe it. (So out of line on the first date.)These two seem so out of place in the Major Case Squad.
I may give them one more week, but I'm not saving my Sunday nights just for Barek & Logan. I had to soothe myself with a tape of Goren & Eames.
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Post by janetcatbird on Oct 3, 2005 11:17:26 GMT -5
Mimi, on the board people call me Catbird. Always nice to have support on an opinion!
Sirenna, it was major case because the targets were chains of expensive jewelery stores and the robber obviously had no qualms about killing people. What was it Barek said to the young man about his mother: "Every cop in this city has a shoot-to-kill order." So, the authorities were taking this seriously. The junkie aspect didn't even come up until the investigation was already underway.
As to Logan, while he has mentioned his mother to previous Mothership partners he has never used it to talk to a suspect. His comments have usually been to belittle certain institutions or conventions ("My mother held a rosary in one hand while she beat me with the other. Next time I'm in a church six of my closest buddies are carrying me."), but his tone has always been sort of defiant. Yeah my mother beat me, so what? I got through it alright! You saw that with "Rum punch". I don't think it was very partner-like of Barek to make him talk about it, that was inappropriate, hopefully we'll see her character adjust to Logan.
--Catbird
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Post by Sirenna on Oct 3, 2005 11:41:03 GMT -5
But why is that major case. Jewlery stores and "no qualms about killing" is murder in general what's so special about this one?
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Post by Sirenna on Oct 3, 2005 11:51:38 GMT -5
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Post by mimi1802 on Oct 3, 2005 11:58:48 GMT -5
Catbird...yeah I like it!
Sirenna,
I agree there was no chemistry but I think showing Logan and Barek as great buddies already would've been inappropriate.
All the awkwardness of a first date was displayed in the episode. From the odd silences, the body language, Logan overdoing it on the crime scene (Barek saying...Relax you've got the job) to the boundary testing.
When establishing trust between two people, I think you need to know how far you can go.
Logan threw the first "trust" punch by breaking the pool stick and by going further than he should've. Barek did the same thing when she involved Logan against his will into a self confession.
Both detectives have put each other in awkward positions to test one another. And now trust is not an issue between them. Barek didn't intefere when Logan was interrogating the suspect in the pool lounge, telling him she trusted his interrogation techniques but that she had his back if things went wrong. Logan gave Barek the same consideration and trusted her interrogation technique; even if he disliked being put on the spot.
I hope to see a relationship where even if they disagree with one another's view or technique it will never stop them to express themselves honestly.
I wouldn't be surprised if the relationship between Barek/Logan is more closely knitted than the respectul yet cold relationship between Goren/Eames.
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Post by Sirenna on Oct 3, 2005 11:59:16 GMT -5
sorry about all the typos. The modify button doesn't appear for me.
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