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Post by Cassie on Nov 18, 2005 17:43:49 GMT -5
Good Point Nicole, but also, if Goren did go in alone and blow his fuse, and still got a confession out of the judge. It would be his word against the judges. Who would the jury believe, the detective or the judge?
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digresser
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 149
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Post by digresser on Nov 18, 2005 19:49:39 GMT -5
Oh, Digresser, what a hoot! The Goren Show ! All Goren, all the time. The picture you painted of him in the produce section reduced me to tears, I was laughing so hard! Thanks for a boost to my day. ;D Thank you Willow2tree, your words were a boost to my day! I wonder if Goren ever got a hold of the actual fellow who got in to see his mom. Does anyone think Goren would try to find him?
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Post by kawaiidragonfoe821 on Nov 19, 2005 4:50:03 GMT -5
LOL! I know what you're getting at, kawaiidragonfoe821, but I was more referring to Goren's persistence in calling Eames by her last name. I know she calls him 'Bobby' a lot. That's an interesting PoV on when Goren, Eames and Carver really did arrive at the judge's chambers. All takes are quite plausible. I agree with Willow2tree, and Digresser, though. I think Goren did head straight for the judge's chamber - it's the sort of thing he would do in a situation like that. Of course, whether Eames and Carver caught him before he actually went in, and managed to draw up a plan of attack is another possibility. Sorry, I didn't think my post would be that far down the line . I was saying as a whole that perhaps Bobby sees 'Eames' as a nickname, just as she calls him 'Bobby'. those quotes were a response to something else. My respect for Bobby as a character went up to the height of the Empire State Building after getting to see this ep a second time, I was totally outraged at the judge using his mother to get to him mentally... a very low blow. If it would have been me in that situation I admit that I would have probably knocked the judge's arrogant block off as soon as I stormed into his chambers. Some amount of time must have elapsed between when Bobby stormed out with Alex following & when he burst into the judges chambers. Perhaps Alex persuaded him to wait for Carver to get there? I loved how Bobby seemed ready to blow his top at one moment, & then did a complete 180. He got the judge all flustered & then got him to admit to having sex w/ the girl (consensual or not, sex w/ a minor is still considered rape, right?). By doing this, he gave Carver grounds for an arrest. As for Bobby 'waving Alex off' before he went storming off, i don't think he was shutting her out, i got this from the look he gave her: 'look i cant let this bastard get away with this. Come if you want, but I'm going regardless.' i think she read the same thing in his face also. As for the guy who harassed his mother, i wouldn't doubt that Bobby would go after him also, but that is for a later date. there are more pressing issues at hand. I think that it was more important at the time for Goren as well as his colleagues to see the judge & person who put the P.I. (thats why he was... right?) up to it in the first place. Like i always say... kill the fire ant queen the rest of the mound dies. ROTF i could SO see Goren doing that in the produce section!
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Post by domenicaflor on Nov 21, 2005 0:43:51 GMT -5
(And, in case you still wonder, actually, it most definitely *is* possible to really enjoy a show and be emotionally involved in it, and still be able to describe gestures and expressions in detail and explore what they mean. ) (snip for brevity) Observer: I have not been able to participate to the level that I have wanted to, on this board and others, due to some personal issues, but I just wanted to step in a moment and say that I appreciate detailed analyses including all gestures and non-verbal communication. (Warning/disclaimer notices are fine - I should remember to use them when I post as well.) I agree with your analysis of Goren and Eames here. The Eames and Goren we see in S5 are light-years away in partnership and personal experience than the pair we saw in S1 "One". Their opinions matter greatly to each other - even when gestured and never spoken. For me, "In the Wee Small Hours" was a return to the high point of CI - Seasons 1 and 2. I thought that everyone's performance was spot on and fine-tuned - including Noth and Sciorra. Colm Meaney was perfectly sleazy as the judge - when I saw him I was reminded of Eames' quote from "Jones" - "I need to wash off the slime..." Good performance from the son and the mother as well. Back to lurking for awhile... D.
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Post by LOCIfan on Nov 25, 2005 19:50:41 GMT -5
Yes, the clothes suggest Goren went immediately to the judge--if so, it says something to the man's self-control that he was able to turn the situation into an opportunity to catch the judge. Patcat Watched the whole show again today! It holds up so well to repeated viewings. Long weekends are grand, aren't they? Anyway, Patcat, I agree that it says A LOT about Goren's self-control and the fact that he always has one eye on his suspect -- no matter what's going on. And, I actually think we get to see the exact moment where Goren makes a decision to turn the confrontation into a trap. At first, when he storms in, he's ranting... Then the Judge starts fighting back. Carver's arrived on the scene and, in response to the Judge's statements about what Goren's mother said about him, Carver says "This isn't necessary". Then, Goren's demeanor changes and he says "Let him talk." Bingo. Right from that moment on, Goren's in charge. "Let him talk." It's like he decides at that moment what he's going to get the Judge to talk about. Everything Goren says and does in that scene after that point is designed to provoke the Judge into making an incriminating statement. Everything Goren says and does in the scene prior to that point is about Goren venting on the Judge.
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Post by filmnoir5 on Jan 28, 2006 19:07:05 GMT -5
Since this was the higest rated new episode this season, I am wondering if there will be more movies next season.
Has anyone heard or read about any future L&O:CI 2 hour movies?
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Post by maherjunkie on Jan 29, 2006 10:39:45 GMT -5
There are supposedly more in the future.
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Post by maherjunkie on Feb 5, 2006 10:43:59 GMT -5
Was Tiana's mother also the cop from "BAdge"? And did it turn out that Ethan killed her daugher?
Please help, I can't remember.
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Post by rosemary on Feb 5, 2006 12:44:26 GMT -5
maherjunkie: Terry Randolph from "Badge" was played by Viola Davis. She also appeared on the SVU, but she isn't credited for another LOCI part than that of Randolph according to imdb.
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digresser
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Post by digresser on Feb 5, 2006 13:14:26 GMT -5
Oni Faida Lampley, who did play Tianna's mother, is also credited as playing the U. N. Official in "Badge".
Also...
Geneva Carr, who played "Faith Yancy", also played "Camilla" in "Pravda".
Colleen Clinton, who played "Jenny Sullivan" in "Baggage", is credited on IMDb as playing "Charlotte Kappel" in this episode (although I can't remember who "Charlotte Kappel" was off the top of my head).
Stewart Summers has apparently appeared in six episodes of CI, including this one, in minor roles. Again, according to IMDb, he's been in "The Saint" as "Detective" (uncredited), "The View from Up Here as "John", "Death Roe" as "Crime Scene Investigator", "The Good Child" as "E.R. Doctor", "The Unblinking Eye" as Attorney and "In the Wee Small Hours: Part 1" as "Detective". He's also had six minor roles on SVU, two on TbJ, and five on the mothership.
Ethan did not kill Tianna, her death was an accident. However, because he was charged because he just left her after she fell and hit the railing. He may also have been charged with supplying her with drugs and bringing her up there, but that I can't remember for sure.
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Post by avemah on Feb 8, 2006 12:44:40 GMT -5
Hey, I'm new to this discussion, having *finally* been able to watch this episode from start to finish (caught the last 1/2 hour last November, not enough to really know what was going on). I agree with most of what's been said, and you can count me among the "Bobby-lovers" (I mean that in a good way). I just wanted to make one comment... As for the guy who harassed his mother, i wouldn't doubt that Bobby would go after him also, but that is for a later date. there are more pressing issues at hand. I disagree. Bobby's not one to 'shoot the messenger'. He knew who was responsible and he *so* got that judge. Totally got him where it hurt. He may keep an eye out for that PI, but I doubt he'd go after him. He got the man responsible.
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psychochik
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Post by psychochik on Feb 8, 2006 13:03:04 GMT -5
But when it comes to his mother I dont think he cares if its the messenger or the person who sent the messenger, he's gonna be pissed and he's gonna do what he has to do. His Mom is one person you dont mess with, he is very protective of her and as soon as you cross that line, whether the messenger or not, you're in trouble and you better watch out cuz you now have Detective Goren on your case from there until eternity.
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Post by Sirenna on Feb 8, 2006 13:49:57 GMT -5
I don't agree about the "crossing the line with his mother" thing. Logan and Logan's mother maybe but Goren doesn't make it personal like that. He has too much self-control now. Also he learned that lession in POI, when he let N/E manipulate the situation with his father with fatal consequences to Conroy and Goren's public reputation - it was part of his growth as a character. He wouldn't let it happen again.
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Post by kawaiidragonfoe821 on Feb 8, 2006 17:05:30 GMT -5
digresser>> Wasn't the UN official from 'Phantom'?
Sirenna>> I think that the judge crossed the line, I mean harassing Goren's poor mom? That wasn't cool & your right, he didn't let it happen again, esp with Nicole. We saw that in 'Great Barrier' when Nicole cheekily asks if his mother helped him 'concoct this theory' about her & which he coolly responds with 'in her wildest delusions, she never spawned anything like you.'. I love the shocked look on her face when it doesn't rattle him.
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digresser
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Post by digresser on Feb 8, 2006 22:39:47 GMT -5
digresser>> Wasn't the UN official from 'Phantom'?
Yep. Good catch! She is in "Phantom", though.
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