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Post by caseyswife on Sept 26, 2006 23:38:19 GMT -5
Liked Wheeler and Kent and Logan was downright snarky funny - kind of like the first few season's of Logan on the Mothership. The writing was sharp and snappy ( even though the ending was lame). Thought the chemistry between Noth and all the newbies was very good. *Thumbs Up* But the cinematography and music and pace concern me. *Thumbs down* This isn't CSI or NYPD Blue for chrissakes! Stop with all the herky jerky camera stuff. I mean once in a while is fine, but the first half hour of this episode almost made me sea sick. The music did get annoying once or twice - way too dramatic. And am I the only one who thought the pace was stilted from all the different "fast paced" scenes? Logan and Wheeler were apart for a lot of the time (or at least it seemed like it) and the cutting back and forth seemed so choppy. I love the new lighting and the sets - it would be great if they would hold the camera still long enough so you could get a good look. caseyswife And Vixens - How GOOD did VDO look in the promo - Bobby is back in action!
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Post by Techguy on Sept 26, 2006 23:46:43 GMT -5
Patcat and Catbird have it exactly right: WORST EPISODE EVER = THE VIEW FROM UP HERE, which also earns the Raspberry of WORST CI VILLAIN EVER.
I also am of the opinion there was, or should have been, a very good story here but....what happened? And right on the heels of the article that says D'Onofrio as Goren gets the melodrama while Noth's Logan gets the B stories--well, here right out the outset of Season 6 is People's Exhibit A for that theory.
Sorry Filmnoir, I must respectfully disagree: this episode had absolutely NO interesting characters, at least not for me. Part of the problem is I felt absolutely no empathy or connection with any of these wanks, nothing that would draw me into their lives and situations. The murdered doctor was a skanky tomcat, the teacher Danielle a whiny seductive brat, her husband a cuckolded abuser turned Zen wannabee in denial, and Keith a hapless horny teen with more hormones than brains. They all deserved to be sent to the woodshed for a really thorough dressing down by Ross and been replaced by real characters of substance.
I was no fan of Barek, but I'm scratching my head as to what was going in with the in-joke between Ross and Logan. That entire exchange looked and sounded demeaning and condescending, and left me wondering what the heck happened between her and Ross and/or Logan. Did she go down in flames in the aftermath of Deakins' exit? Did she request a transfer after Logan came on to her in "To the Bone"? Did she return to the FBI? A little explanation is in order here.
I'm still not sure how I feel about ADA Kent and whether I care how often she shows up in future episodes. Right off the bat she pegged the killer wrong, singling out the husband that Danielle set up, and quite frankly, I felt she was more window dressing than a person of substance. Did we really need to see her on-screen just so Logan and Wheeler could ask for a warrant?
Two things made watching this episode worthwhile for me. The first is the interactions between Logan and Wheeler, who already display more chemistry in a single episode than Logan and Barek did the entire last season. The other is the continued unfolding of Captain Ross' persona; when he says that if any teacher, male or female, laid a hand on either of his two boys he would break 'em in two--I believe him.
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Post by caseyswife on Sept 26, 2006 23:51:25 GMT -5
AAIIGGHH! Thank you for reminding me, Techguy... Loved the insight with Ross - I believe he would snap someone who messed with his boys in two, as well! caseyswife
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Post by LOCIfan on Sept 26, 2006 23:54:22 GMT -5
I liked Wheeler--spunky. Reminds me of Eames. Logan likes strong women, he likes to spar with 'em. Maybe conflict with her will bring the old Mikey back. My feelings exactly about Wheeler. She's SPUNKY and she's young and she has freckles! What cop has freckles?! Well, this one does, and she's good at her job and didn't play second fiddle to Mickey. I think he'll come to respect her right quick. 2011 must have not been around last season where practically every episode was phoned in. Last year, except for less than a handful of episodes, the show looked flat, felt stale, and was on its way out. At least this year, so far, there's some pop. And better yet, a possibility that it will be around for a bit longer. Okay, orsonb, you've hooked me. What's your "insider" status? Why all the cheerleading for THIS season of LOCI? What are you, on NBC's or Leight's payrolls? If you're a longtime fan of the show, why only pop out of the woodwork now? And why reveal yourself as an "insider" with info about Balcer that couldn't be revealed, then go back to posting as though you're a regular fan? What's your take on all this? Are you an "insider"? A fan? Both? Which first, which second? At least Ointmentfly lets his bias be known and then lets the cards fall where they may with his info. What's your perspective? Inquiring minds want to know... Not, in any way, trying to chase you off the board. Just curious, since you, yourself revealved yourself as an "insider" in your earlier post. I just hope you'll share more about yourself and your status with the show with the rest of us.
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Post by janetcatbird on Sept 26, 2006 23:56:44 GMT -5
Actually, I'm 16 at an all boys school and trust me, if one of the students slept with this teacher at our school, no matter how much an outcast he was, he would be a school legend. But that's here at my school in Australia so I don't know about you guys over there. By "legend" do you mean admired as a hero, or simply notorious and infamous? I'm not saying word wouldn't get out or that kids wouldn't talk, far from it. But the crowd at the courthouse (and why weren't they in school, anyway?) was cheering, congratulatory/hyper, and snapping pictures--prompting Keith to raise his arms in a triumphant gesture. That's what I don't get. It would be more likely to have whispers of "I knew there was something off about him!" and eye rolls at his confirmed freak nature. (I'm 21 by the way, several years out of high school but a co-ed public place like he attended. And while my schools never had direct experience with it, there were stories in the papers about others.) There's more for me to respond to, but my roommate is trying to sleep. Later. --Catbird
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Post by Jefferaldo on Sept 27, 2006 0:01:46 GMT -5
Actually, I'm 16 at an all boys school and trust me, if one of the students slept with this teacher at our school, no matter how much an outcast he was, he would be a school legend. But that's here at my school in Australia so I don't know about you guys over there. By "legend" do you mean admired as a hero, or simply notorious and infamous? I'm not saying word wouldn't get out or that kids wouldn't talk, far from it. But the crowd at the courthouse (and why weren't they in school, anyway?) was cheering, congratulatory/hyper, and snapping pictures--prompting Keith to raise his arms in a triumphant gesture. That's what I don't get. It would be more likely to have whispers of "I knew there was something off about him!" and eye rolls at his confirmed freak nature. (I'm 21 by the way, several years out of high school but a co-ed public place like he attended. And while my schools never had direct experience with it, there were stories in the papers about others.) There's more for me to respond to, but my roommate is trying to sleep. Later. --Catbird admired as a hero
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Post by sarahlee on Sept 27, 2006 0:37:15 GMT -5
caseyswife--if you really want to see good-lookin' VDO, check out jefferaldo's new CI opener--yeah, baby!
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Post by Techguy on Sept 27, 2006 1:59:42 GMT -5
Janethyland, how old were the teacher and student at this boarding school you mention? Keith, the boy in this episode is 16, who by law is not considered to be of age to give informed consent to sex, and the teacher Danielle is a person in position of trust. Over here that's not stereotyping, it translates to statutory rape no matter how you slice it and dice it. I'm with Ross--if an adult who SHOULD KNOW BETTER laid a hand on a child, break 'em in two.
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Post by Techguy on Sept 27, 2006 3:38:24 GMT -5
Janethyland, for all her regression to teenage girl ways, I still consider Danielle a sexual predator. I have zero empathy or sympathy for an adult who takes advantage of someone who's emotionally weak and vulnerable. Breaking her in two is too light a punishment.
To turn this around a bit, how would you react if it was disclosed that a teacher had sex with Goren when he was 16 and who knew he was dealing with his mother's illness and father's abandonment? Would it make a difference if the teacher was male or female?
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Post by Metella on Sept 27, 2006 7:08:35 GMT -5
I also didn't love it - didn't hate it .... BUT that opening scene is way to contrived - thrown on the spikes of a fence? Really. Then the few blood drops and fade out? come on, how blatant can you be? Awful. So far both openings sucked rat behind.
Then it got into the story line and was ok. I liked the new partner, she does look way too young, though.
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Post by Summerfield on Sept 27, 2006 7:49:13 GMT -5
Techguy, you read my mind. I too thought Ross's comment to Logan about Barek could have come from Logan's "proposition" in "To The Bone." Either that, or it was a slam against AS. "You'll never work in this town again...or at least not for Dick Wolf!" I'm scratching my head over this episode. The best I can come up with is messy. It was all over the road. The teacher was stunted because she had to change schools her senior year? Yet she was able to attend college and get a degree... The student didn't have any moral compass due to his upbringing. I would have like to seen them explore the kid's psyche. It looks like Wheeler might work. She does look young, but at my age, everybody looks young. Hey, it looks like there's finally a real doctor in the Croydon family! And..."The View From Up Hear" was the worst episode ever. Note to caseywife: Gun through broken glass...HOT!
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Post by Patcat on Sept 27, 2006 8:40:48 GMT -5
I always feel validated when people whose opinions I respect agree with me--this is about THE VIEW FROM UP HERE.
And I liked what I saw of Ross last night. H-m-m, Eames' father seems a good guy, Deakins was, now Ross...
I suspect Barek's departure won't be elaborated upon, if only because Ms. Sciorra was rumored to be difficult. My completely off the wall take is that Barek had an affair with Goren and had to get away from him (g).
Patcat
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Post by phishytrey on Sept 27, 2006 8:40:57 GMT -5
First I love CN in whatever he is in but this was not one of the best. Logan is a sexist and is always on the prowl for women and all the manly things the old NY had to offer in the Red light district. ( Remember when he shot the cop?) But I think the writers tried to hard to make Wheeler's character known right off the bat. Logan is suppose to be the senior partner but he really didn't lead to much. More of a follower in this show. I do like the fact Logan was a little more able to be human and share his outside life. At the end when he was in the hallway and trying to convince the woman to tell the kid- the father figure was great. Logan always tries to help the kid who is getting the bad rap.
I liked the exchanges but some type of reason for Barek leaving would have been great. Something like Logan hit on her once and it made her uncomfortable, so she asked for a new partner or to be transferred. Why just leave these character departures up in the air?
I can only hope that CN storylines get better. I agree these two actors are not getting their share of quality stories. The ending came up quick and just dropped. The writers spent all this time writing good exchanges between Logan and Wheeler, but then showed up late to work one day and wrote the ending.
I am interested to see more of the exchanges between Logan and Wheeler and the captain.
PS The age thing has been going on for years, only lately have woman been getting charged with rape. It used to be a male character building exercise if a young kid could get in bed with an older woman for his first time. I agree teachers shouldn't do this stuff but it does happen from time to time. And outrage only makes it more appealing to some.
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lovesong
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 98
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Post by lovesong on Sept 27, 2006 9:41:50 GMT -5
Firstly, ITA that "The view from up here" was undeniably awful. I loved "Tru Luv." I thought it was really good TV, but for the second week in a row, it is clear this is a new CI. I will miss and mourn the old CI (seasons 1-3 and a few of 4) but I am GRATEFUL we aren't getting more of the garbage from season 5. Season 5 was really really bad in just about every way until the final two episdoes of the season. Last week ws pretty good, this week was very good, and I'm hoping when they get warmed up both teams will be great, in a new way. I too dislike the new camera work, but I'm glad NBC sprang for some lights, lol. I didn't even notice the music. Loved the snark and spark from Logan and Wheeler (I already like her better than Eames!). Ross is no Jimmy D, but it is clear he isn't supposed to be. I'm going to like him. I echo the indifference to the new ADA. I didn't like Carver much, so I don't care that he's gone, but there isn't anything to like or dislike yet about this woman. Carver spent a lot of time getting dressed and she spends a lot of time doing her hair. That is all that I can offer about either frankly. Thought the story here was weak, but the players did well with the silly premise. I didn't think Logan was being disrespectful to Wheeler w/ the freckles remark, I took it as somewhat self depricating with the hints at his own age. At 50 something, Noth is probably the oldest of all the stars, :shrug: I also interpreted the remark about Barak sa more of a swipe at AS and an acknowledgement to fans that she was a terrible choice. A mea culpa so to speak. I also caught this weeks House, and CI had better be worried, very worried. House is essentially the same show as the Goren eps, with a medical premise (the Logan eps have a more cop like feel and differ stylistically). But House is far better written and executed, and Hugh Laurie has the charisma VD left behind in season 3. I love both shows, and I don't want to see CI end, so I hope they keep up with the improvements, lose the new cinematographer and give House a run for the money.
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Post by janetcatbird on Sept 27, 2006 10:05:29 GMT -5
i hope they didnt stereotype this subject matter. i worked in a boarding school once where a male teacher fell in love with a girl student. the girl went on to Oxford to finish her studies and they went on to marry. the teacher carried on teaching and just retired recently. The marriage is still intact. I hate to think what would have happened if all those around them had reacted differently,and not recognised the quality of their love because they didnt recognise their own blind spots!!! Janethyland, Did falling in love include sex while she was a student? I don't deny that age can be irrelevant to emotional connections; I've formed some very close friendships with older males. But NOT sexual. Teenage hormones are screwy and difficult enough, not counting factors that make things even worse. From what you've said it sounds like the teacher and student waited until things were legal and OK before taking their relationship to that level, hence the understanding from their peers. I'm not sure what you mean by stereotype. Danielle did not seem to wish him any harm, and from her own emotional stuntedness she probably thought of it as an equal relationship. But two factors: 1) She's married. That should have stopped things in their tracks. 2) Keith did not strike me as terribly mature or sensitive. I wouldn't have wanted a guy like that when I was 16. Besides, I don't care how emotionally intimate and soul-matish you are, there are legal concerns (to say the least) so don't do the sex! They knew better and they did it anyways, and Danielle especially should have known to steer clear. Jefferaldo--is this a gender thing or what? I guess I can imagine a couple of horny teenage guys thinking he's a stud, but certainly not all of them. (Danielle didn't strike me as the teacher everybody falls for.) And there were a lot of teenage girls cheering and snapping pictures with their cell phones at the courthouse, which makes me want to spit. If anything, they'd think "Oh, so that's why he did so well in her class" and beat him up even more. As to a move/changing high schools doing harm: I think the hard part was the timing for her. If you move in the junior/senior year of high school, that's not a lot of time to make friends and establish new relationships before leaving home. I suppose she's old enough to have kept up with her friends from back home, but that could understandably hurt. I'm not sure it would emotionally stunt you and lock you in your teenage years (shudder), but things would be rough for a while. --Catbird
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