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Post by trisha on Nov 30, 2004 17:09:08 GMT -5
Of coarse, most of us would rather not see VDO go, but ...
If you had to pick someone to take his seat across from Erbe/Eames, who would it be and what would the character be like?
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jaquetta
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 171
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Post by jaquetta on Nov 30, 2004 18:24:35 GMT -5
No one but VDO would be any good - I watched the show originally because of him - but if he did leave, to keep Eames and Co, I wouldn't mind seeing Chris Noth on a weekly basis again. No HBO so I haven't seen him in ages.
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js
Silver Shield Investigator
Posts: 143
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Post by js on Nov 30, 2004 18:48:57 GMT -5
No VDO, no show. I can't think of anyone who could bring the various VDO nuances to the show. Anyone can learn the lines and follow direction. D'Onofrio has created Goren, quirks and all, which has made the show interesting and enjoyable. No VDO, no show.
js
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Post by Enthralled on Nov 30, 2004 19:27:52 GMT -5
VDO is the essence of the show - you can't replace Goren. I couldn't get into the show for the first season - because Vincent made me uncomfortable - but as like all fine things, he is definitely an acquired taste.
I'm afraid that LOCI without Goren would be like all the other Wolf shows - probably still a solid show, but no fizz. Vincent adds the fizz. I like fizz. Fizz is fun.
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Post by onebyone on Nov 30, 2004 20:30:23 GMT -5
I'm afraid that LOCI without Goren would be like all the other Wolf shows - probably still a solid show, but no fizz. Vincent adds the fizz. I like fizz. Fizz is fun. Exactly. I want my fizz. I watch the other L&Os if I have nothing to do, this is the only one that I obsess over. Without Vincent, it will be the same ole same ole.
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Post by trisha on Nov 30, 2004 20:32:00 GMT -5
A lot of actors sizzle on screen, and a lot of the sizzle has to do with chemistry. KE and VDO had great chemistry in seasons 1 & 2, but things got weird in season 3, maybe because of KE's pregnancy and absence. Lately have felt no spark between them at all, and I'm not jumping on the rumor band wagon, but if he really is even half as bad as the "insiders" have claimed, that would certainly explain it.
Anyway, this isn't the "Could the show go on without him" thread. It's the "Who Would You Pick to Replace [Him]" thread.
So, no more "The show will end without him..." Pick an actor and the type of character that if, God forbid, VDO were replaced, you would like to see take the seat across from Erbe/Eames.
I just thought of a good one: Corin Nemec, he's the quintessential sexy nerd. He has great comedic timing and an all around solid range (which is high praise coming from me). He and Erbe would also make a striking pair.
The premise of the show demands that at least one of the detectives be a profiler, and we know Eames doesn't fit that bill, so he has to be a profiler. I'd like the character to be another reader, a little quirky -- but no fruit cake. And for the love of God, not another tragic childhood. No drama in this guys life. He's a happy little puppy with keen eyes and ears, but who also has a ferocious side for really bad people. A puppy with mean bite and a killer smile.
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Post by NikkiGreen on Nov 30, 2004 20:59:31 GMT -5
Corin Nemec?! CORIN NEMEC??!! Nah, I'd rather see him return as Jonas Quinn in the ninth season of Stargate SG-1, since it seems like RDA is only going to be in the entire season for only about four episodes. Since nothing lasts forever... Corin Nemec is a good choice. Or...how about the Pretender himself, Michael T. Weiss. . He was quite convincing with all of the different types of characters he played. Logan only goes well with Briscoe. ;D
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Post by trisha on Nov 30, 2004 21:36:20 GMT -5
I would love to see Corin back on SG1, too, but sadly it seems that it will never be. I read on the Gateworld forum that a fan asked Michael Greenburg if Jonas would be coming back during season 9 at the last UK con, and he gave a firm no I know that Corin has been working pretty steadily since SG1, but I can't imagine he would turn a show like CI down. He is a fine actor who could certainly handle the part, and even enhance the show in much the same way that he did for SG1. SG1 has seemed so much darker without him, and dark is also the main problem I have with CI these days. I don't watch tv to become depressed. I think Weiss is also a fine choice. I have never really found him very attractive, but I have friends who used to swoon over him. [eta: for those who don't know who Corin is, here's a pic.]
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Post by NikkiGreen on Nov 30, 2004 22:01:29 GMT -5
Well, my extremely attactive choice would be Joe Penny. I guess I'm one of the few who didn't mind when Daniel ascended and Jonas came on aboard. I guess this means you've seen Season 8 episodes, huh? I'm sort of jealous. I spent last Saturday watching all of S7 episodes. It was like...this will be the last one. Next thing I know, it's 1:00AM and I finished the whole season. I can't wait to see how Jack gets thawed out. I've got Gateworld bookmarked. ;D ETA: Nice picture.
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Post by trisha on Nov 30, 2004 23:11:50 GMT -5
Clearly, we need a Stargate thread ;D Joe Penny is a handsom man. Good one! There are a lot of great actors out there. I can't believe that so many people are so closed to the idea of VDO being replaced that they can't even play with the idea
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Post by KATIE on Dec 1, 2004 1:22:47 GMT -5
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Post by romulanavatra3 on Dec 1, 2004 2:10:50 GMT -5
hey trisha iam suprised form what i read i nthat last interview that is the vincent d'onofrio sectition, i sort of got the impression that he would proabbly be staying for a while, and from what i gathered he would proabbly for a couple of more seasons. mind you i guess we are sort of going through the same sort of rumor mill phase as when kathryn erbe got preggenant before season three started. as for this chris noth thing i remmeber reading that he would be reprising the role of logan in a series of law and order movies so i guess that this could very well be a starting point. iam intrested to know one thing yes eames may not be a profiler but neither really is goren( he has great profilling skills, but that does not really make him a dedicated profiller). i would like to know you overall oppion of the eames and goren dynamic in season four in each episode so i can understand why you feel that there is no spark between them at all( iam more than a little suprised by that comment myself). one other question i have trisha is why dont you think eames could handle being the lead detective in the series if goren wa to leave( for what ever reason). i personally think that she not only has the skill and the capabillity( she has more htan enough brain power of her own to do well), but she also has a certain phyiscal presserance that works very well for her. plus she acutally learns from people like goren and attempts to adopt new ideas and is willing to acceapt other people biefes and ideas even if she herself does not entierily agree with them. regards rom.
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Post by trisha on Dec 1, 2004 9:15:17 GMT -5
Rom, D'Onofrio may just be saying that to quell the rumors. He has been pretty clear in the past that he doesn't plan to sign on again. If he has changed his mind, great, but it wouldn't crush me to see him go. I'm getting tired of his sad life and I'm ready for a change. I don't know how to explain how or why I feel no spark between Erbe and D'Onofrio, Rom. I guess you will just have to wait and see the 4th season for yourself to understand. I don't have any problem with Eames being the lead detective, to be honest, I think that it's been shown that Eames has seniority over Goren already. Erbe as the lead actor of the show would be fine with me, too. Being the "lead" has nothing to do with it, it's being a profiler that makes the difference. In the episode The Insider, we learned that Goren is indeed a profiler. Eames has learned a lot from Goren, but she is no where near his level when it comes to profiling, and that is needed for the premise of this show. It would be fine for her to take a more equal part in solving the puzzle, and I think that the writers have done that with her already, but when it comes to psychological motivations, she can really only go so far without help. So, what do you think about a replacement for D'Onofrio? Are there any actors you like? What type of character would you like to see Eames working with? Someone like Goren? Not like Goren? Younger? Older? Someone with another sad backstory or someone with a happier disposition? What type of person do you think she should be paired with if Goren HAD TO BE written out of the show? [ETA: Katie, here are some screen captures from an appearance that Joe Penny made on 7th Heaven last year. I LOVE Gary Sinise, but sadly he is already the lead of L&O competitor, CSI: New York. The show is aweful, but it seems to have a lot of fans, so I don't foresee it being cancelled or Sinise leaving it for a spot on CI.]
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Post by Observer2 on Dec 1, 2004 15:12:17 GMT -5
Rom, D'Onofrio may just be saying that to quell the rumors. He has been pretty clear in the past that he doesn't plan to sign on again. If he has changed his mind, great, but it wouldn't crush me to see him go. I'm getting tired of his sad life and I'm ready for a change. From what I’ve seen of him, and read in interviews, D’Onofrio does not strike me as the kind of person who would say the opposite of what he’s feeling, just “...to quell the rumors.” And I can’t tell if you’re blurring the lines between actor and character in your own mind, or only in your writing. Whose sad life are you tired of? Your writing sounds as though you’d like to see D’Onofrio leave – not just that you’d prefer to see less of Goren’s working through of his own personal issues. As for replacing him, I think it’s a questionable proposition at best. There are actors out there who can portray a decent cop, a decent partner, and probably even a decent profiler. But I don’t remember Wolf and Balcer going on at great length about doing a show focused on a profiler. I remember them talking about doing a show focused on an extraordinary detective, on the order of Sherlock Holmes. Goren does Holmes one better – combining that brilliant intellect with effective intuition (i.e., combining exceptional “left brain” abilities with exceptional “right brain” abilities), and adding a profound level of empathy – which gives him both a window into the criminals’ minds and an opening through which to manipulate them. There are a few actors out there who can portray genius, and even brilliant intuition. But the ability to convincingly portray the complex, nuanced empathy and empathetic rapport we see in Goren is vanishingly rare. If D’Onofrio leaves the show, Balcer will still be a brilliant writer; but there will be more limits on what he can do. Asking who should replace D’Onofrio in a show with Criminal Intent’s focus on psychological complexity is like asking who should replace Baryshnikov in a dance company. No one else is going to step in and be able to do what he does on the level that he does it. All you can do is try to find the next best that’s out there, and simplify your choreography.
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js
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Posts: 143
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Post by js on Dec 1, 2004 15:19:34 GMT -5
Yes, Observer. You eloquently said my exact thoughts. You did it better, however. There is no replacement for VDO as Goren. A new person has to bring his/her own talents.
js
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